Catherine Rampell and Scott Lincicome on Trump's Tariffs
From The Al Franken Podcast by The Al Franken Podcast
May 24, 2026 · 53 min
About this episode
Catherine Rampell and Scott Lincicome discuss the implications of Trump's tariffs and the complexities of the refund process for affected businesses.
It’s been over a year since Trump’s “Liberation Day” when he rolled out his global tariffs, but the Supreme Court struck those down resulting in chaos and confusion about what happens next. Guest Host Catherine Rampell, of The Bulwark and MSNOW, welcomes Scott Lincicome, VP of economics at the Cato Institute, to try to make sense of how the 166 billion dollars in tariffs will be refunded to businesses that were impacted. Catherine and Scott break down the bureaucratic red tape of the refund process, why small businesses are once again getting left behind, and the valid fears of political retaliation that are keeping major corporations silent. And with the U.S. government taking multi-billion-dollar equity stakes in everything from steel mills to quantum computing, we discuss the rise of “state capitalism.” It’s not exactly the free market that Republicans have been cheering for generations. Plus, after Trump’s landmark trip to China, many Americans are experiencing what Scott calls “China envy.” READ Catherine’s writing in The Bulwark: https://substack.com/@catherinerampell/posts READ Scott’s writing: https://www.cato.org/people/scott-lincicome
People in this episode
Host: Catherine Rampell
Guest: Scott Lincicome
Topics covered
- tariffs
- political economy
- state capitalism
- small business
- political retaliation
- China relations
Keywords
- tariffs
- refund process
- small businesses
- state capitalism
- political retaliation
- China envy
Mentioned in this episode
Organizations: The Bulwark, Cato Institute
Places: China, U.S.
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