About this episode

Claude Steele discusses his book 'Churn' and the psychological barriers to connection and trust.

What if one of the biggest barriers to connection, performance, and trust isn’t prejudice—but something more subtle, more pervasive, and harder to detect?In this powerful episode of the Passion Struck podcast, I sit down with renowned social psychologist Claude Steele to explore his groundbreaking new book, Churn.Claude introduces the concept of churn—the internal psychological state we experience in high-stakes situations when we worry about how we might be judged based on our identity. Whether in classrooms, workplaces, medical settings, or everyday interactions, churn silently shapes how we show up, how we perform, and how we relate to others.We explore how churn differs from bias, why it can be just as corrosive, and how even well-intentioned people can become trapped in cycles of hesitation, misinterpretation, and disconnection. Most importantly, Claude reveals a hopeful path forward—how trust, “wiseness,” and simple human behaviors like listening and belief can dramatically reduce churn and unlock human potential.This conversation will change how you see your interactions—and give you practical tools to build deeper trust in a divided world.Passion Struck is the #1…

People in this episode

Host: John R. Miles

Guest: Claude Steele

Topics covered

• psychology
• trust
• identity
• connection
• performance
• human behavior

Keywords

• churn
• psychological state
• identity judgment
• trust
• human potential
• social psychology
• connection

Mentioned in this episode

Organizations: Passion Struck Network

More episodes of Passion Struck with John R. Miles

• The Science of Connection and Why We Underestimate Others | Nicholas Epley - EP 760 · April 28, 2026 · 59 min
• The Identity Gravity Trap: Why We Snap Back to Old Habits | John R. Miles - EP 759 · April 24, 2026 · 27 min
• How to Manage Energy Not Time: Dr. Diana Hill on Wise Effort | EP 758 · April 23, 2026 · 57 min
• Nobel Laureate Alvin Roth: How Incentives Shape Your Life | EP 757 · April 21, 2026 · 56 min
• Why We Circle Change (And How to Finally Step Through) | John R. Miles - EP 756 · April 17, 2026 · 18 min
• How Do You Design a Meaningful Life | Bill Burnett & Dave Evans - EP 755 · April 16, 2026 · 1h 3m

Explore listener stats, chart rankings, contacts and more on the Passion Struck with John R. Miles podcast page.