Conscious Chatter

In Episode 341, Kestrel welcomes Dr. Joanne Brasch, the Assistant Director at the California Product Stewardship Council (CPSC), to the show. A network of local governments, non-government organizations, businesses, and individuals supporting policies and projects where producers share in the responsibility for managing problem products at their end of life, CPSC is California's thought leader and expert on Product Stewardship and the Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) movement. "We're most proud of our textile EPR program because we achieved a lot in SB 707 that set a new level, a new generation of EPR programs that take a higher priority and implement a lot more reuse and repair throughout the program." -Joanne THEME — EXTENDED PRODUCER RESPONSIBILITY & TEXTILE WASTE DIVERSION This episode is the second in our two-part series dedicated to exploring some of the layers around Extended Producer Responsibility, or EPR, and Textile Waste Diversion. In line with this conversation, I want to share about an upcoming event I'm collaborating on that's taking place in Los Angeles on June 10th. The Recovered Textile Exhibit is hosted by the City and County of Los Angeles, the California Product Stewardship Council, and the LA Cleantech Incubator. It's funded by CalRecycle, LA Sanitation, and others, and is in collaboration with Afflare.co and Fashion Is Outrageous. There will be keynote speakers, discussions, and interactive activities that my cofounder Gabi and I helped develop, all with a focus on textile circularity and diverting textiles from the landfill. Additionally, the PRO (Producer Responsibility Organization), Landbell, will be present at the event. If you're interested in attending, you can RSVP here. If you're able to join, I hope to see you there! On the last show, we touched on some of the big picture ideas around EPR, and many of the questions around how we can make these circular systems practical. On this week's episode, we're diving deep into the first-ever textile EPR bill in the U.S., SB 707: The Responsible Textile Recovery Act of 2024. While this isn't the first EPR policy to hit California or the nation, it is the first to cover TEXTILES. I chat with someone who played an integral role in the legislative process for the bill – we dive into more on their open-collaborative approach and the importance of community-informed programs, we explore what the "most diverse board requirements" means within the context of SB 707, we learn about how feedback played a distinct role in the legislative process including some from the Or Foundation, and we discuss some of the definitions within the bill like REUSE and RECYCLE, with a focus on unpacking the definition of REPAIR, which is the first global definition that includes upcycling. You will hear words and phrases like PRO, Needs Assessment, dynamic, legislative and regulatory process, and more. We do our best to help contextualize these definitions along the way, but if you have questions, let me know. I don't want this to feel like another policy conversation that leaves you in the dark – I want it to feel like you can feel welcomed into it, as this is a monumental bill for California and the sustainability and fashion industry as a whole. One of my favorite things about this bill is that it's DYNAMIC, meaning it will change over time, and be rewritten every 5 years, based on key findings and learnings. So remember – your voice can play an important role in how this bill continues to evolve moving forward. Also, to note – when this episode was recorded, our guest's new title had not yet been released publicly. Congrats to her, as she is now the Assistant Director – you'll actually hear her reveal it to us later on in the episode. Quotes and links from our conversation: "If we're shopping in a different way 20 years from now, this program can adapt to that because the plan is rewritten every five years and has evidence-based decision-making provisions within the program." -Joanne on why SB 707 being a dynamic bill matters "I think the open collaborative approach has really been making sure everyone is using the same language and understands the same process so we can get the best engagement now." -Joanne on CPSC's approach to developing community-informed programs "We know repair costs more. We know that it's labor intensive, but we also know, you know, it's a greater GHG reduction and opportunity to again create new products from existing materials." -Joanne on the importance of incentivizing repair in the bill Recovered Textile Exhibit, June 10th (2026) in Los Angeles, CA California Product Stewardship Website CPSC Instagram

In Episode 329, Kestrel welcomes Jennine Jacob, a personal stylist and Instagram phenom, to the show. You may know Jennine from viral videos that explore the many layers of nuance connected to the power of finding your own style. "Anytime I see people quote unquote dressing for their body type, those outfits that look good, they can all be explained through style principles. The rule of thirds, contrast, proportion, texture, color theory. So why do we have to attach a value to a person's body shape when that's not even necessary? I really want to call into question why we use certain language because there's a lot of dismissal of visual language not just in fashion but also in the arts and architecture, and in the spaces that we move that have tremendous impact in how we navigate the world." -Jennine MARCH THEME — PERSONAL STYLE IS SO MUCH MORE THAN *VANITY* This month, we're shifting the narrative a bit toward the conversation around style. I recently did a post on Instagram about why I post daily outfits and how it's not about vanity, and instead – it's about storytelling, sustainability and branding. It resonated so much with folks and made me feel optimistic amidst a time that can be pretty gloomy lately. I talked about the power of knowing the stories connected to your garments and how that storytelling can come through in the way you wear them. I talked about how when you have intimate connections with your garments, you tend to take care of them so they last longer. I talked about how identifying your personal style is a key part of building your brand, and honing in on the colors you consistently wear can play into determining or realizing your aligned visual identity. I even mentioned the whole "fashion is frivolous" annoying narrative, and how it's totally ridiculous considering how much your clothing choices do actually truly matter. Turns out, that's one of the many topics we crack open with this week's guest. "Is The Internet Messing With Your Style?", IG reel Kestrel mentions "The Power Dynamics Of Comfort", IG reel Kestrel mentions "Quiet Luxury Helps The Oligarchy", IG reel Jennine mentions "Focus in on not just how you want to look, but what you want to say with your style, and why you want to say it." (40:06) -Jennine Jennine's Website Follow Jennine on Instagram

In Episode 327, Kestrel welcomes Sanchali Pal, founder and CEO of Commons, an app that rewards you for living and spending sustainably. On Commons' app, you can get rewarded for shopping sustainable brands and for taking climate actions like thrifting, taking public transportation or eating plant-based. "When people think about the actions they can take that are sustainable, the most obvious ones are things like flying less or recycling or eating more plant-based. People don't always think about their clothing habits, but I think that's really changing with the conversation around fast fashion. I mean, the fashion industry has a greater environmental impact than the airline industry. It's like two to three times as much, which is pretty crazy. And so it is really exciting to start to see that conversation happen and start to think through what part we can all play in shifting that industry together." -Sanchali FEBRUARY THEME — DIVERSE WAYS TO COMBAT FAST FASHION This week's episode is brought to you in collaboration with Commons. As a cohost of their Anti Fast Fashion Challenge, I'm stoked to share more about how you can get involved to boycott (in many different ways) harmful fast fashion brands this month. While it can be challenging to fathom, especially being so deep within the sustainability and fashion conversation, fast fashion is booming. From the H&Ms and Zaras, to the more recent addition of ultra fast fashion brands like Shein and Temu, our culture is addicted to fast fashion. From the cheap prices to the convenience factor to the instant gratification, the allure of fast fashion is real. But as many of you know, buying fast fashion comes with an intense environmental and human impact. Fast fashion aligns itself with disposability and waste, boasting crazy low prices. The materials are predominantly synthetic and often lose their shape after a couple washes. The synthetic materials shed loads of microplastics into the environment. Garment workers face exploitation and non-livable wages. All the while, social media and marketing continue to drive us to think we need another new piece of clothing to stay relevant. It's a lot. And that's why I am so excited for this conversation – and to be cohosting this month's Anti Fast Fashion Challenge. A way for us all to collectively come together to challenge that intense urge to buy another cheap item, and instead – not shop, mend something, get something tailored, shop secondhand, or invest in a brand that centers sustainability. "Our spending is the best data source we have on our emissions." (14:26) -Sanchali "It Starts At Home?" — research Sanchali mentions on household spending Join The Anti Fast Fashion Challenge Commons Sustainable Spending Tool / Brand Ratings How Commons Rates Brands Commons Website Listen To The Second Nature Podcast Follow Commons on Instagram

In Episode 325, Kestrel welcomes Emily Fenves, the founder of lander line - a platform she created in September 2021 - after feeling burnt out with her own consumption habits. As a regular shopper, Emily found herself spending an exhaustive amount of time browsing, buying, returning, and purging. She embarked on a journey to learn more about the "why" behind her overconsumption, and decided to help others do the same. "I think a lot of people assume that investment pieces mean luxury. For me, specifically, I always think about – can I pass this down to my daughter? Investment pieces can be secondhand, too. Whether I'm shopping new or secondhand, I'm always asking myself that question – is this something I can pass down to her?" -Emily JANUARY THEME — EXPLORING THE NUANCE AROUND *INVESTMENT PIECES* This month, we're going all in on – investment pieces. What does that really mean? Well, that's one of the aspects we unpack. But if you google around and start diving into the discussion online, you'll find a lot of people talking about things like: LONGEVITY, JUSTIFYING HIGHER TICKET ITEMS, HIGHER QUALITY, HIGHER COSTS, and EVERGREEN STYLES. We touch on cost per wear, the idea of fewer better things, and recommendations when you're searching for investment pieces. It's also personal – so remember to take that into account as you listen to this week's guest. What you deem an investment piece may not necessarily be what someone else identifies as an investment piece – and to me, that's some of the fun of it. Speaking of this week's guest – she self identifies as a former overconsumer-turned-fair-fashion-advocate who loves secondhand and influencing others to quit fast fashion. RealReal's 2024 Resale Report lander line's Substack Follow Emily on Instagram

Episode 323 features Kestrel (just me!) in the first-ever solo episode of the show. With a primary focus on vulnerability, Kestrel shares some of the rollercoasters she has faced personally over the last year (from health to finances), why she and Nat are parting ways when it comes to regularly hosting the show, the true costs of producing a podcast, as well as a question on whether performative vulnerability is what we are seeing too often from the industry. "To all of you interested in sustainable fashion or those of you who work in the industry - I want to ask you a question: are you ok!?"-Kestrel OCTOBER THEME — MAYBE VULNERABILITY IS WHAT FASHION REALLY NEEDS As you can see, Nat is not here. It's super bittersweet, as doing the show hand-in-hand with someone I love, a best friend, and someone I admire deeply was truly magical. At the same time, realities happen, things shift, and sometimes what you anticipate doesn't actually work out in the end. Being honest about the journey is, and always has been important to me. Nat is amazing as many of you already know. Moving forward, she won't be cohosting with me on a regular basis, but she will jump back in as a guest or cohost on the show on and off down the line. I know this might be confusing for you since there have been a lot of shifts on and off throughout the year. First of all, thanks for sticking around, for caring deeply about the show, and believing in the potential power of change in the fashion space. This episode is all about vulnerability — I hope you can feel my hope to tear down some of the curtains that often separate us for connecting on a deeper level. Here's what you'll hear from me: A bit about my person health stuff I've gone through over the last year Why it wasn't possible for Nat and I to continue co-hosting together - hint, hint: independent media is hard A little insider info on what it costs to run a podcast Some musings on whether it's possible for the sustainable fashion / fashion realm as a whole to get vulnerable and what that could look like

Episode 321 features Teju Adisa-Farrar, the founder and co-creator of the Black Fiber & Textile Network and the creator/host of the Black Material Geographies podcast, alongside Layla K. Feghali, the founder of River Rose Remembrance, a Plantcestral & Ancestral Re-Membrance practitioner, cultural worker, author & story re-collector (archivist). Teju is currently the Director of Outreach & Programs for the Fibers Fund, and co-creates with members of BFTN. Layla's book, The Land In Our Bones, showcases an exploration of the herbs & land-based medicines of Lebanon & Cana'an, highlighting the power of culture's relationship with land. "I think of culture as a way of relating to your environment, including those around you, making sense & beliefs based on your environment, & creating a sense of a shared identity based on the place that you are in. With the creation of colonialism & the transatlantic slave trade, and this very globalized neoliberal world, now culture is less connected to a place & more connected to what and how we consume." -Teju "I feel like that relational way of existing or of relating is kind of what ultimately yields or inspires I guess what folks would call a sustainable way of navigating things. Because it requires a conversation beyond the self and with the entirety of the living world that I dwell in and that I'm a part of and that I impact and that impact me, and the ways that they're alive." -Layla MAY THEME — Connecting With Nature To Unveil Ways To Reimagine Futures As the sustainability conversation continues to evolve, we often will hear mention of regionality, or the importance of thinking more locally in supply chains or manufacturing. While this is a great aspect to explore further, it only touches the surface of the depth connected to geography, location and place. This week's guests each approach education and storytelling through place-oriented lenses. While they are each uniquely different, these geography-oriented avenues teach us so much about what is often missing from the conversation. As we've explored through various angles this season, culture is integral to sustainability. Our guests this week shed light on the many ways that culture can teach us about land, history and legacy. How understanding the land, its history and the cultures woven into it, can lead us toward restorative justice and regenerative practices. As one of our guests so beautifully writes in her book: "The real focus of sustainability should be to recenter these Indigenous technologies rooted in multigenerational relationships to place, and teach younger generations how to harvest in ways that ensure the life of these plants will not only continue but spread per this ancestral knowledge." Links from the conversation: Teju's Website Black Fiber & Textile Network River Rose Remembrance Website Follow Teju on Instagram Follow Layla on Instagram

Episode 319 features guests Stella Hertantyo, the co-host of the Conscious Style Podcast, alongside Emily Stochl, the host and creator of Pre-Loved Podcast. Stella also works as writer and communications coordinator, while Emily also works as the Vice President of Advocacy & Community Engagement at Remake. "There are so many painful roots when you look back at the way that certain dyes came about and you know, cotton farming — there are so many different legacies of colonialism that existed and still exist. But I also want to take the word painful out of that sentence and say that we have also learned to acknowledge the roots of sustainability because not all of them have pain at the center. And I think what I've learned with so much interest and joy is the different textile heritages that exist across the continent — from natural dyes to hand looming to the ways that people grow certain crops, and yeah, just different ways of expressing and using textiles as ways to archive and also to preserve culture. And there are so many people that do this incredible work and I think that that is a really, really important acknowledgment that I had to come to realize in my own journey." -Stella "Labor rights are the foundation of what we know to be fashion activism in general, if we think back to the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory, which I know that something here in the United States, folks maybe learn about in school. This was another fashion industry-related disaster that led to a swath of movement-building around how we advocate for safer workplaces for people working inside the fashion industry. You know, roots to International Women's Day, roots to some of the labor protections that we know and understand today, like the 40-hour work week. These are all things that if you look at the fashion industry from a history perspective, labor and the fashion industry, it is totally intertwined." -Emily APRIL THEME — COMING TOGETHER TO BUILD A BETTER FASHION FUTURE Whether it's legislation, science research & innovation, transformation in language, the storytelling tools & platforms in which we use to communicate, the evolution of definitions, the popularization of the second hand economy or labor rights advocacy – so much has changed within the sustainable fashion movement over the last decade. This week, we really put our new round table format to work. We dissect the sustainable fashion industry through a timeline of events, paying homage to Fashion Revolution Day – a movement that, in conjunction with many others, has brought more mobilization and change to the space. Join the four of us – all podcasters & storytellers – for this expansive breakdown. Links from the conversation: "What Is Extended Producer Responsibility in Textiles — and What's Missing From Current Policies?", article on Conscious Life & Style by Stella Become a Good Ancestor Podcast by Layla Saad (mentioned by Stella) Conscious Style Podcast Website Pre-Loved Podcast Website Follow Stella on Instagram Follow Conscious Style Podcast on Instagram Follow Emily on Instagram Follow Remake on Instagram

Episode 317 features guests Megan L. Schnitker, an Indigenous Traditional Herbalist and Niha Elety, a fashion advocate, designer, chef, and storyteller. Megan is the owner of Lakota Made LLC, who offer plant medicinals and personal care products. Niha is the founder and CEO of fashion brand, Tega Collective, a brand that co-creates with Adivasi (Indigenous) communities celebrating their craft and knowledge with each collection. "American herbalism was founded on Indigenous knowledge and use of all the plants that are in North America. And so, American herbalism is founded on Indigenous women's knowledge, Indigenous storytellers' knowledge. And we're very rarely credited for giving colonizers that knowledge. I credit the herbalists that saved a lot of that knowledge and are using it and kept it alive, but it came from Indigenous people, it came from Indigenous women, it came from Indigenous medicine; it came from us." -Megan "The history of fashion production for centuries has been by women primarily. I'm from India, so in India, there's large groups of artisans and garment workers and weavers, and a majority of the population that are in those kinds of professions are women. And over the years, I would say with the industrialization of textile production and all of that, men often became the heads of big fashion companies that we see today. So, a lot of them have profited from knowledge that a lot of female artisans and designers have been creating for a long time." -Niha MARCH THEME — Acknowledging The Confines of Gender & The Folks Disrupting Stereotypes One of the recurring themes our incredibly powerful guests shared this week is that for true sustainability to exist, we must go beyond commodification and capitalism to focus on consent, compensation, credit, collaboration and co-creation where the individual human is valued and respected, and where preserving culture is at the forefront. We question things like ownership and agency, and the power dynamics that play into who gets to decide what is deemed "fashion" or "medicine". Who are the knowledge holders in fashion, wellness, herbalism & health spaces? Whose knowledge do we value? And what are the deep rooted reasons our society often doesn't give credit to certain genders and their intersectionalities? We learn that craft and wellness are embedded into the wisdom and intuitive ways of life for Indigenous people and cultures, from the Adivasi communities in South Asia to Indigenous people like the Lakota here in the U.S. And that by design, the erasure and extraction of female knowledge, the matriarchs of so many cultures, is a constant struggle. The solution is more than just words, it's the actions and uplifting and amplifying of Indigenous peoples, and the honoring of traditional ways that have real potential to impact systemic change. It's also in slowing down our everyday interactions and the way we share information and knowledge, in a way where we actually respect and pay homage to the origins of ideas. NOTE: Megan had to jump off our call to make it to her child's parent teacher conference, so we weren't able to hear her thoughts on our last question during the episode. We were thankful that she was able to send through her ideas on "how to slow down when everything feels fast" so we can share them with you here: I take time at least one day a week or one morning a week. I have nothing scheduled and I clean my house so I can sit in a clean house in silence. I sit there and look at all my family pictures on the walls, family that's passed on, good times, and sad times and I practice gratitude. Gratitude for everything I have, everything I receive and for the moments that brought me this far. If it's warm out (my fibromyalgia doesn't like cold), I'll go outside and drink a cup of tea or coffee in my backyard and listen to the sounds of nature, and just sit and practice gratitude for everything that brought me to that moment. I sit with the chaos of my kiddos and I smile and thank the universe / Tunkasila for sending me these amazing beings I get to mother, I thank my girls all the time for being who they are and teaching me so much and also bringing so much value to my life; without them, the motivation wouldn't be there. Before bedtime, I read my girls books, and as I read them this story, I cherish the moments before sleep and thank the universe for keeping me here and getting me here. -Megan Quotes & links from the conversation: Lakota Made Website Niha's Website Tega Collective's Website Follow Lakota Made on Instagram Follow Niha on Instagram