Heterodox Out Loud

How did America’s universities lose the trust of the public, and what will it take to restore faith in higher education? In this episode, we are joined by Benjamin and Jenna Storey, renowned scholars, co-authors, and directors at the American Enterprise Institute’s Program on the Future of the American University. Together with host John Tomasi, they undertake a searching examination of the forces eroding confidence in universities and offer a roadmap for rebuilding their legitimacy and civic purpose.The conversation draws on the Storeys’ personal journeys through academia, they explore how universities have shifted away from their civic mission, the implications of declining viewpoint diversity, and the urgent need to re-envision liberal education in a polarized era. Their discussion critically engages with recent initiatives, including the founding of university-level Schools of Civic Thought, and emphasizes both the perils and promise of institutional reform amidst increasing political and public scrutiny.Read the report: “Civic: A Proposal for University Level Civic Education” (AEI, December 2023) In This Episode:💥 The crisis of public trust and universities’ civic responsibilities💥 The decline of viewpoint and ideological diversity in academia💥 Innovative models for enhancing open inquiry and faculty diversity💥 The case for new academic structures—Schools of Civic Thought💥 Navigating political pressures and governmental reform efforts💥 The enduring value of liberal education and practical wisdom About Benjamin & Jenna:Benjamin Storey, Ph.D, is a senior fellow in Social, Cultural, and Constitutional Studies at the American Enterprise Institute (AEI). He is concurrently a research fellow at the Civitas Institute at the University of Texas at Austin. At AEI, he focuses on the culture of higher education, the nature of liberal and civic education, and efforts to enhance viewpoint diversity on college and university campuses. He co-organizes AEI’s conference series on the Future of the American University and its workshop on the Conservative Intellectual Tradition for University Faculty.Jenna Silber Storey, Ph.D, is a senior fellow in the Social, Cultural, and Constitutional Studies department at the American Enterprise Institute (AEI), where she concentrates on political philosophy, civil society, classical schools, and higher education. She is also the co-organizer of a conference series on the future of the American university. Dr. Storey is concurrently a research fellow at the Civitas Institute at the University of Texas at Austin, and a Tocqueville scholar at Furman University, where she was previously research professor, assistant professor in politics and international affairs, and the executive director of the Tocqueville Program.Dr. Storey is the coauthor, with her husband, Benjamin Storey, of Why We Are Restless: On the Modern Quest for Contentment (Princeton University Press, 2021). Together, the Storeys are working on a book titled The Art of Choosing: How Liberal Education Should Prepare You for Life. Follow Heterodox Academy on:Twitter: https://bit.ly/3Fax5DyFacebook: https://bit.ly/3PMYxfwLinkedIn: https://bit.ly/48IYeuJInstagram: https://bit.ly/46HKfUgSubstack: https://bit.ly/48IhjNF 🔗 Find out more about Heterodox Academy at: https://linktr.ee/heterodoxoutloud

What does it mean for a university to become a battleground against deep-seated prejudices and historical tensions? In today’s episode, we dive into these challenging questions with our distinguished guest, Cary Nelson, a celebrated scholar and ardent advocate for academic freedom.Nelson shares his insights on the intersection of anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism in academia, a topic explored in his new book, "Mindless: What Happened to Universities?" The conversation examines how the lines between critique of Israel and hostility towards Jewish students blur, becoming toxic and divisive forces across campuses, from historical shifts that turned post-1948 anti-Zionism into a rejection of Israel's existence to the phenomenon of hatred and the campus protests that undermine foundational academic values. Nelson calls for reclaiming the core purpose of academia as a community of imperfect learners where dialogue and understanding prevail. In This Episode:Historical context of anti-Zionism and its transformation into anti-SemitismThe unique pressures faced by Jewish students on campusesThe role of social media in spreading campus protestsDistinctions between psychological and intellectual safety in AcademiaThe undermining of the university's role as a space for diverse perspectives About Cary:Cary Nelson is Jubilee Professor of Liberal Arts & Sciences Emeritus at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign and an affiliated faculty member at the University of Haifa. He holds an honorary doctorate from Ben Gurion University of the Negev. Over his distinguished career, Nelson has authored or edited 36 books and published over 400 essays, focusing on modern poetry, critical theory, the politics of higher education, and issues related to antisemitism and the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. From 2006 to 2012, he served as president of the American Association of University Professors (AAUP), advocating for academic freedom and shared governance. Nelson’s latest work, “Mindless: What Happened to Universities?”, published on March 6, 2025, examines how universities have deviated from their commitment to shared intellectual principles, leading to environments where extremism and intolerance can flourish. Follow Heterodox Academy on:Twitter: https://bit.ly/3Fax5DyFacebook: https://bit.ly/3PMYxfwLinkedIn: https://bit.ly/48IYeuJInstagram: https://bit.ly/46HKfUgSubstack: https://bit.ly/48IhjNF 🔗 Find out more about Heterodox Academy at: https://linktr.ee/heterodoxoutloud

What happens when mental health care becomes intertwined with prevailing political ideologies and biases? Today on Heterodox Out Loud, we’re joined by Andrew Hartz, president and founder of the Open Therapy Institute and a long-term member of Heterodox Academy. Andrew joins John Tomasi to explore the increasing prevalence of sociopolitical bias within the realm of mental health therapy. Andrew shares his motivations for founding the Open Therapy Institute, highlighting the concerning shifts in therapy practices caused by activist-oriented approaches and sociopolitical biases. He discusses the need for a more balanced, patient-centered therapeutic approach that respects diverse perspectives without conflating therapy with broader ideological battles. Andrew sheds light on the startling trend of therapists dismissing patients due to their political views and the broader issue of bias pervading mental health training and practice. In This Episode:The rise of sociopolitical bias in mental health therapyThe four levels of bias impacting therapistsThe incompatibility of patient-centered therapy with politically driven judgmentThe influence of activist-oriented norms in therapeutic contextsThe role and objectives of the Open Therapy InstituteViewpoint diversity and the challenges faced by conservative therapists For more insights and updates from the Open Therapy Institute, visit their website: https://www.opentherapyinstitute.org/ About Andrew:Andrew Hartz, Ph.D, is a practicing clinical psychologist. He was formerly a professor in the clinical psychology doctoral program at Long Island University, where he also completed his Ph.D. He completed his clinical internship at Columbia University Medical Center, and he also completed training at Mount Sinai Hospital and the William Alanson White Institute. For several years, he’s written about political issues and mental health for outlets such as the Wall Street Journal, City Journal, Discourse, the Federalist, Real Clear Education, Heterodox Academy, and the New York Post. Follow Andrew on X: https://x.com/Hartz_PhD Follow Heterodox Academy on:Twitter: https://bit.ly/3Fax5DyFacebook: https://bit.ly/3PMYxfwLinkedIn: https://bit.ly/48IYeuJInstagram: https://bit.ly/46HKfUgSubstack: https://bit.ly/48IhjNF 🔗 Find out more about Heterodox Academy at: https://linktr.ee/heterodoxoutloud

What happens when the principles of law clash with evolving ideologies in academia? Join us today as we delve into the transformative journey of legal education with Rebecca Roiphe, a lawyer, visiting fellow at the Siegel Center for Academic Pluralism, and author of the upcoming book, "The Devil's Advocate: How Law Schools Abandoned the Law."

How do schools navigate the complexities of inclusion, polarization, and freedom of expression while fostering a vibrant learning environment? Today, John Austin, Head of School at Deerfield Academy, joins Heterodox Out Loud to explore these questions and share insights from the groundbreaking report, Thriving in a World of Pluralistic Contention: A Framework for Schools.

What new vision can pluralism bring to today’s universities? Today, founder of Interfaith America Eboo Patel, joins John to discuss how pluralism can be a guiding principle in transforming higher education away from rigid ideological confines towards a more inclusive and dynamic intellectual space.

What happens when the guardians of cultural narratives and societal norms become inseparable from the very hierarchies they critique? Today, we explore the concept of "symbolic capitalists" with Musa al-Gharbi, author of We Have Never Been Woke: The Cultural Contradictions of a New Elite and assistant professor at the School of Communication and Journalism at Stony Brook University.