Informal Economy Podcast: Social Protection

In this episode, we resume the building block of our social protection solar system on the topic of delivery and provision of social protection. In this second episode of the series, we will turn to India, to understand how informal workers organizations can play an important role to improve access to their members by facilitating the last mile delivery of services or benefits. The Self-Employed Women’s Association, SEWA, set up in India their so-called Shakti Kendras, or SSKs. I talked to Susan Thomas, the National Coordinator of Health and Childcare programmes at the Lok Swas-thya SEWA Trust (LSST), to learn more about this worker-led initiative. Susan explained how the Shakti Kendras operates, how they help informal workers to access social protection in India, how digital tools are being integrated in their work, as well as the next steps of the Shakti Kendras. *** Learn more: -BLOG: Bridges to Better Lives: SEWA’s Community Health Workers (October 05, 2019), by Annie Devenish, Laura Alfers https://www.wiego.org/blog/bridges-better-lives-sewas-community-health-workers/ -We are the bridge’: an implementation research study of SEWA Shakti Kendras to improve community engagement in publicly funded health insurance in Gujarat, India (2022), by Susan Thomas, Sharmada Sivaram, Zubin Shroff, Ajay Mahal, Sapna Desai https://gh.bmj.com/content/7/Suppl_6/e008888 -BLOG: In India, One-stop Shops Increase Access to Healthcare, Nutrition and Social Security Services for Working Poor (May 15, 2017), by Laura Alfers https://www.wiego.org/blog/india-one-stop-shops-increase-access-healthcare-nutrition-and-social-security-services-working/ *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons)

In this episode, we start a new building block of our social protection solar system with the first part of the topic on delivery and provision of social protection. We will be looking at the innovations in the delivery of services and cash grants, focusing on informal workers and on the role that informal workers organizations might have in improving access to these workers by facilitating the last mile delivery of services or benefits. To open this block, we will turn to Africa and look into three cases of provision of child care services. First, we go to South Africa, to talk to Richard Dobson about the pop-up child care facility in the Warwick Junction market, in Durban. Richard is an architect and co-founder of the NGO Asiye eTafuleni. Next, we move to Accra, in Ghana, to talk to Dorcas Ansah, WIEGO’s Accra Focal city coordinator. We discussed the guidelines for implementing child care facilities in the Ghanaian capital markets and the plans for expanding the initiative. We finish our tour in Rwanda, where the market vendors association SITRIECY is also implementing child care facilities in the Kigali markets. We talked to SITRIECY’s secretary-general and StreetNet International treasurer Jeanette Nyiramassengesho. She explained their approach to combine provision of child care for informal workers’ children in markets with the creation of a community savings group. *** Learn more - WIEGO: Child Care in Markets: An E-Book https://www.wiego.org/research-library-publications/child-care-in-markets/ - Working in Warwick: Including Street Traders in Urban Plans https://www.wiego.org/research-library-publications/working-warwick-including-street-traders-urban-plans/ - WIEGO - Child Care in Markets project: https://www.wiego.org/project/child-care-markets/ - Guidelines and Standards for Day-Care Centres in and around Markets in Ghana, by Susan Sabaa, Dela Quarshie-Twum https://www.wiego.org/advocacy-worker-education-resources/guidelines-and-standards-day-care-centres-and-around-markets-ghana/ - Webinar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wn9niHLL8vI - About Asiye eTafuleni https://aet.org.za/about-asiye-etafuleni/our-story/

In the third episode of the governance building block we move on to the discussion of legal frameworks and social protection. How can legal provisions of participation, access to information, transparency and equality be leveraged to include those workers into social protection systems? What are the main legal frameworks? How does administrative justice work for this end and how it can be used a tool for informal workers in their advocacy efforts? To help us understand these questions we invited Pamhidzai Bamu. Pamhi holds a masters and a PhD in Labour Law from the University of Cape Town. She is currently the President of the African Labour Law Society. She has consulted for the International Labour Organisation and the Southern African Development Community on various projects. She is currently the Africa Coordinator of WIEGO’s Law Programme. *** References Social Protection for Self-Employed Informal Workers in Sub-Saharan Africa: A rights-based assessment of the impact of the COVID-19 crisis https://www.wiego.org/publications/social-protection-self-employed-informal-workers-sub-saharan-africa-rights-based R202 - Social Protection Floors Recommendation, 2012 (No. 202) https://normlex.ilo.org/dyn/normlex/en/f?p=NORMLEXPUB:12100:0::NO::P12100_INSTRUMENT_ID:3065524 C189 - Domestic Workers Convention, 2011 (No. 189) https://normlex.ilo.org/dyn/normlex/en/f?p=NORMLEXPUB:12100:0::NO::P12100_ILO_CODE:C189 African Charter on Human and Peoples' Rights https://au.int/en/treaties/african-charter-human-and-peoples-rights *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons)

In this episode, we start a new building block of our social protection solar system with the first episode on the topic of governance. We have invited two guests to lay the groundwork for this block, to help us understand social protection governance, as well as the new concerns and potentials brought by digitization. We start with Tony Roberts. Tony is a researcher based at the Institute of Development Studies on the campus of the University of Sussex in the UK. He has worked on the use of digital technologies in social justice organisations since 1988. As a founder of the African Digital Rights Network his research focuses on the human rights implications of introducing digital technologies. He will share some of the findings of his report on digitization and social protection. On the second part, we talked to Gbenga Sesan. Gbenga is the Executive Director of Paradigm Initiative, a non-profit organisation that works with digitization and data protection rights in Africa. He will bring some concrete cases of how digitization affects informal workers.

In episode five of the systems’ mapping, building blocks approach, we continue to explore the topic of registration. This time, we look closely at the Cambodian IDPoor programme, to understand to what extent a government-led effort to improve how beneficiaries of social assistance and social protection schemes are effectively accounted for – and what are the gaps, challenges and merits of this new registration drive. To understand the Cambodian case, we invited Bunly Than. Bunly is the lead of the Inclusive and shock-responsive social protection system project at Oxfam Cambodia. *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons) References WIEGO Resource Document #30 (2023). Home-Based Workers’ Access to Social Protection: Lessons Learned from the IDPoor Programme in Cambodia. Available at: https://www.wiego.org/publications/home-based-workers-access-social-protection-lessons-learned-idpoor-programme-cambodia Government of Cambodia (2021). Performance Assessment of the Cash Transfer Program for Poor and Vulnerable Households during COVID-19. Available at: https://nspc.gov.kh/Images/GiZ_CT_Policy%20Brief_20210602_Design_Draft_2021_06_02_17_46_02.pdf

This is the third and last episode of the financing building block. Previously, we discussed alternative ways to finance social protection extension for waste pickers in India and Argentina, and the struggle to finance gig workers in Rajasthan. Now we explore the challenges of financing social protection in a changing world of work. What are the possible paths, strategies and innovations countries are undertaking to include informal workers? What about digital platforms: is there room to improve social protection for these workers? To discuss these and other issues we invited two guests: Sarah Cook and Ruth Castel-Branco. Sarah is a Professor and Head of the School of Economics at the University of Nottingham Ningbo China. She has held UN positions as Director of UNRISD and UNICEF’s Office of Research-Innocenti. Her research focuses on China’s economic and social development, covering issues of gender, labour and social policy. Ruth Castel-Branco is a Senior Researcher at the Southern Centre for Inequality Studies at the University of the Wit-waters-rand. Her research is focused on the casualization of labour, worker organizing and the redistributive role of the state. She holds a PhD in Sociology also from the University of the Witwatersrand. They talked to us about some of the findings and debates arising from their research. *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons) References Podcast: Financing Social Protection for Waste Pickers in India and Argentina. Informal Economy Podcast, episode 33 https://soundcloud.com/informaleconomypodcastsp/33-financing-social-protection-for-waste-pickers-in-india-and-argentina Pune Waste Pickers’ Innovative Efforts to Fund the Extension of Decent Work and Social Protection, WIEGO Resource Document 33. Available at: www.wiego.org%2Fpublications%2Fpune-waste-pickers-innovative-efforts-fund-extension-decent-work-and-social-protection&token=83d341-1-1701176313090 Efforts of Argentina’s Informal Waste Pickers to Finance Decent Work and Social Protection through Extended Producer Responsibility Legislation, WIEGO Resource Document 34. Available at: www.wiego.org%2Fpublications%2Fefforts-argentinas-informal-waste-pickers-finance-decent-work-and-social-protection&token=e9c485-1-1701176313090

WIEGO inaugura una nueva etapa de su podcast. A partir de este episodio, vamos a comprender mejor las piezas del sistema de protección social, para poder mejor comprender los retos, oportunidades y dificultades que enfrentan los trabajadores informales. Todo eso ofreciendo la perspectiva de los trabajadores, desde una aproximación ascendente. En esta etapa, daremos atención especial al tema de la digitalización, aunque no será el único aspecto discutido aquí. Vamos a mirar como la tecnología está siendo utilizada para mejorar la inclusión de trabajadores informales, pero también comprender los riesgos y retos involucrados. En los próximos episodios, vamos a investigar las distintas partes del sistema de protección social, y mirarlo como un sistema solar, en la que en el centro están las políticas, legislación, governaza, financiación; luego afuera están los diseños de los programas, questiones sobre elegibilidad y cuestiones relacionadas; y por fin, asunto relativos a la implementación – como registro, entrega de beneficios etc. En el primer episodio de la cartografía de sistemas, usando el enfoque de bloques de construcción, nos sumergimos en el tema de la financiación de los regímenes de protección social para los trabajadores informales. La financiación es uno de los elementos clave del "sistema solar" de protección social, y supone un reto especial en el caso de los trabajadores informales, que en muchos casos no tienen un empleador que comparta la carga de los costes de salud, las pensiones, el cuidado infantil y otras prestaciones laborales. Vamos a conocer a un experimento de financiación alternativa de la protección social y el trabajo decente para los recicladores de Buenos Aires, Argentina. Para ello, hablé con Andrés Cappa. Andrés es docente de la Facultad de Ciencias Económicas de la Universidad Nacional de Lomas de Zamora y de la Universidad de Buenos Aires y ha dirigido una investigación de WIEGO sobre cómo los movimientos de trabajadores utilizaron los marcos de responsabilidad extendida del productor para avanzar en la extensión de la protección social y la mejora de las condiciones laborales en Argentina. *Nuestro tema musical es Focus de AA Aalto (Creative Commons) Referencias Pune Waste Pickers’ Innovative Efforts to Fund the Extension of Decent Work and Social Protection, WIEGO Resource Document 33. Available at: https://www.wiego.org/publications/pune-waste-pickers-innovative-efforts-fund-extension-decent-work-and-social-protection Efforts of Argentina’s Informal Waste Pickers to Finance Decent Work and Social Protection through Extended Producer Responsibility Legislation, WIEGO Resource Document 34. Available at: https://www.wiego.org/publications/efforts-argentinas-informal-waste-pickers-finance-decent-work-and-social-protection

In 2021, WIEGO has launched the project “Challenging the global orthodoxies which undermine Universal Social Protection”. In a nutshell, the project aimed to examine some of the dominant ideas in the field of social protection that were hindering the concrete inclusion of informal workers in these schemes. Exactly one year ago, I invited the coordinator of this project, Florian Juergens-Grant, to talk about what this project was about and its research perspectives for that year. You can check our conversation on episode 26 of our podcast. Now that the project has just been finalized, I invited Florian again to discuss the main findings, to unpack how these dominant ideas operate and to bring some cases where alternatives have emerged to challenge the premises of these ideas. References Tight Tax Net, Loose Safety Net: Taxation and Social Protection in Accra’s Informal Sector. WIEGO Working Paper No. 45 https://www.wiego.org/sites/default/files/publications/file/working-paper-45-taxation-socialprotection.pdf Did Mexico’s Seguro Popular Universal Health Coverage Programme Really Reduce Formal Jobs? WIEGO Working Paper No. 46. https://www.wiego.org/sites/default/files/publications/file/wiego-working-paper-no46.pdf Financing Universal Social Protection: The Relevance and Labour Market Impacts of Social Security Contributions. WIEGO Working Paper No. 47. https://www.wiego.org/publications/financing-universal-social-protection-relevance-and-labour-market-impacts-social Efforts of Argentina’s Informal Waste Pickers to Finance Decent Work and Social Protection through Extended Producer Responsibility Legislation. WIEGO Resource Document No. 34. https://www.wiego.org/publications/efforts-argentinas-informal-waste-pickers-finance-decent-work-and-social-protection Pune Waste Pickers’ Innovative Efforts to Fund the Extension of Decent Work and Social Protection. WIEGO Resource Document No. 33. https://www.wiego.org/publications/pune-waste-pickers-innovative-efforts-fund-extension-decent-work-and-social-protection Webinar: Is social protection to blame for informality? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1OlNQkpc2c

In India, the government has set a huge undertaking: to register 380 million informal workers on a new database, so that it could allow the delivery of social security payments. This database, called e-Shram, was launched in August 2021. But, of course, this initiative was followed by a range of doubts, problems and barriers that has been hindering the implementation of this social registry system. To help us better understand the e-Shram – the promises, shortcomings, challenges, and most importantly, the Indian context – we invited Avi Majithia. Avi is WIEGO’s Delhi Focal City coordinator and holds a master’s degree in Regulatory Governance from the Tata Institute of Social Sciences (in Mumbai, India), and works closely with informal worker’s organizations in Delhi. *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons) References e-Shram official website: https://eshram.gov.in/ Article 14: "The Incomplete Project Of E-Shram, India’s Database Of Unorganised Workers" https://www.article-14.com/post/the-incomplete-project-of-e-shram-india-s-database-of-unorganised-workers-620dc42806e13 Scroll.In: "e-Shram: All you need to know about India’s first centralised database for unorganised workers" https://scroll.in/article/1004199/e-shram-all-you-need-to-know-about-indias-first-centralised-database-for-unorganised-workers India Spend: "No Documents, No Benefits: How India’s Invisible Workforce Is Left To Fend For Itself" https://www.indiaspend.com/no-documents-no-benefits-how-indias-invisible-workforce-is-left-to-fend-for-itself/ The New Leam: "Lack of Documents and Registration Deprive India’s Migrant Class of State Offered Benefits & Welfare Schemes" https://www.thenewleam.com/2020/12/lack-of-documents-and-registration-deprive-indias-migrant-class-of-state-offered-benefits-welfare-schemes/ Hindustan Times: "Documenting the story of India’s migrant distress" https://www.hindustantimes.com/analysis/documenting-the-story-of-india-s-migrant-distress/story-sVC8sCHFetXYBPKLa1OhZM.html WIEGO Delhi Focal City webpage: https://www.wiego.org/delhi

In the episode 20 of our podcast, we discussed the first round of the WIEGO longitudinal survey, conducted in 2020. In this special episode, we will discuss the report of the second round of this global survey. In this stage, 11 cities around the globe were part of the research that explored how the fallout of the pandemic affected informal workers’ income, working hours, access to healthcare, but also their coping strategies, demands and the government responses in the second year of the pandemic. To discuss some of the main findings of the research, we invited Ana Carolina Ogando and Mike Rogan. Ana Carolina is Wiego’s Research Associate and holds a PhD in Political Science. Mike is an Associate Professor in Economics and Economic History at Rhodes University in South Africa and he is a researcher at WIEGO. In this special episode, we also played some clips from workers testimonies taken from two webinars of the global survey project. *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons) *** References COVID-19 Crisis and the Informal Economy Study – Round 2 report: COVID-19 Crisis and the Informal Economy Study page: https://www.wiego.org/covid-19-crisis-and-informal-economy-study-0 Webinar: There is No Recovery without Informal Workers: Towards a Better Deal for the Global Working Poor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0g1EXHeAfjU Webinar: There is No Recovery Without Informal Workers: The View from 2021: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIQqLBKYyjU&list=PLOdX1pDW0yXI3R0X-pTRdtK5_zeS0XcXF&index=11

Over the last few years, universal social protection and the government responses to the Covid-19 crisis has generated important debates in the field of social protection. The Universal Social Protection 2030 framework, for instance, has gained support from a variety of key social protection stakeholders, including national governments, the ILO, IMF, World Bank, and other United Nations agencies, as well as global civil society organizations. However, certain key principles and actions remain contested in practice at both the level of global financial institutions and within the roll-out of schemes at national level – which highlighted the importance of the role of the ideas. Much of the contestation over the desirable nature and role of social protection has its roots in implicit assumptions underpinned by neo-classical economic theory, resulting in powerful policy ideas which counteract the key principles of Universal Social Protection 2030, and ultimately undermine the extension of fair, equitable and sustainable provision of social protection to informal workers. In order to unpack, shed light into these assumptions and help us understand these dominant ideas and the actors behind it, we invited Florian Jurgens-Grant. Florian is leads, at WIEGO, the project “Challenging the global orthodoxies which undermine Universal Social Protection”. Before joining WIEGO, he worked on social protection for the ILO and HelpAge International. *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons) References Blog: Are Unfounded Assumptions About the Informal Economy Undermining Universal Social Protection?, by Florian Jurgens-Grant https://www.wiego.org/blog/are-unfounded-assumptions-about-informal-economy-undermining-universal-social-protection Blog: World Bank’s Push for Individual Savings Provides Little Protection for Crisis-hit Workers, by Florian Jurgens-Grant https://www.wiego.org/blog/world-banks-push-individual-savings-provides-little-protection-crisis-hit-workers Op-Ed: The World Bank and IMF are using flawed logic in their quest to do away with the informal sector, by Mike Rogan, Max Gallien and Vanessa van den Boogaard https://theconversation.com/the-world-bank-and-imf-are-using-flawed-logic-in-their-quest-to-do-away-with-the-informal-sector-170325

For the past two years, the world has been facing one of the biggest challenges of our lifetime, with the Covid-19 crisis. In this last episode of the year, we invited again Laura Alfers, the Social Protection programme coordinator at WIEGO, and Rachel Moussié, deputy coordinator of the Social Protection programme and head of the Child Care initiative, also here at WIEGO, to discuss the way in which the pandemic has exposed blind spots in social protection systems and reinforced women informal workers’ exclusion. In this talk, they explained the impact of the pandemic in their work and in the field of social protection globally. They also highlighted how WIEGO and workers’ organizations in the informal economy are engaging with social protection and developing and deepening alliances with labour movements. *Our theme music is Focus from AA Aalto (Creative Commons) References: Wiego Page on COVID-19 Crisis and the Informal Economy Study: https://www.wiego.org/covid-19-crisis-and-informal-economy-study-0 Blog: Are unfounded assumptions about the informal economy undermining universal social protection?, by Florian Juergens https://www.wiego.org/blog/are-unfounded-assumptions-about-informal-economy-undermining-universal-social-protection For Informal Workers: COVID-19 Crisis Resources https://www.wiego.org/informal-workers-covid-19-crisis-resources Statement: Workers take fight for social protection to ILC, by Global Alliance of Waste Pickers, HomeNet International, IDWF, StreetNet International, WIEGO and SEWA https://www.wiego.org/publications/workers-take-fight-social-protection-ilc