Paleo Protestant Pudcast

The Lutheran, Reformed, and Anglican heirs of the Protestant Reformation continue to make news by not attracting attention from observers of American Protestantism. The co-hosts, Korey Maas (Lutheran), Miles Smith (Anglican), and D. G. Hart (Presbyterian), talk about two recent articles about traditional Protestantism that either imply or claim that such Christianity is down on the mat for the count (think boxing). One is Brad East's "Goldilocks Protestantism" and the other is Casey Spinks "Does Traditional Protestantism Have a Future?" The conversation may not be as hopeful as some listeners want. But along with the last episode on non-denominational Protestantism, this one reveals further challenges that confessional Protestant communions face. Follow some of us -- Miles Smith @ivmiles and D. G. Hart (for now) @reallyoldlife.

The Pudcast returns with co-hosts Korey Maas (Lutheran), Miles Smith (Anglican), and D. G. Hart (Presbyterian) in the after glow of a very long holiday season -- that seems to get longer the older the observer becomes. The recording starts with question of whether the five to six weeks between Thanksgiving and New Years -- when everyone seems to return to pandemic levels of output in the workplace -- is too long. Included is attention to the particular aspects of holiday observance among Lutherans and Anglicans (with Lutherans getting lots of credit for using the phrase, "The Divine Service" most often). Material that stimulated the discussion was Ross Douthat's speculation that secular liberalism has run out of steam and Eli Lake's report on the Jewish-Americans who wrote so many of the secular Christmas songs. Listeners who have not seen Whit Stillman's movie, "Metropolitan" should do so asap even if it is no longer Christmas or Advent or Debutante Ball season. Owing to the recent death of former POTUS, Jimmy Carter and Donald Trump's election victory, the co-hosts also speculated about the effects of past and future presidents on the religious vibe in the United States and elsewhere. Bonus content: here is an introduction to Washington Irving's Old Christmas, a story that shaped American customs surrounding the holiday.

The vibe for this recording was solemn even if the co-hosts Korey Maas (Lutheran), Miles Smith (Anglican), and D. G. Hart (Presbyterian) were also excited for the upcoming marriage of our only confessional Protestant bachelor (sorry ladies). The reason for the somber mood was Miles Smith's piece at MereOrthodoxy on evangelicals and politics. There he suggests that American Protestants have lost a sense of nations sitting under God's judgment. In which case, the presidential campaign and the results could be less a story of redemption than they reveal God's rebuke of an errant society. From that starting point, conversation ranged to the degree to which confessional Protestants suffer from viewing the United States as a redeemer nation, how millennialism affects nationalism, differing estimates (Augustinian or Eusebian) of Christian government, and even whether Christians can learn a tragic sense of politics from H. L. Mencken. No sponsors, but it should have been Joy dishwashing detergent.

The Woody Allen movie, "Manhattan," includes a scene where two couples are walking and the one played by Michael Murphy and Diane Keaton unveil their Academy of Overrated. To this body they assign Gustav Mahler, Isak Dinesen, F. Scott Fitzgerald, Lenny Bruce, Norman Mailer, Mozart, , Vincent Van Gogh, and Ingmar Bergman. The co-hosts on this recording, Korey Maas (Lutheran), Miles Smith (Anglican), and D. G. Hart (Presbyterian), consider their own list of overrated theologians. The ones discussed are Karl Barth, the recently deceased Juergen Moltmann, and C. S. Lewis. The reason behind raising the question is not to belittle any of these theologians' achievements but to consider how it is that a theologian -- when there are so many -- emerges as the "go to" authority for ending a doctrinal debate. It also relates to confessional Protestant theological traditions in which those students training for a specific communion are going to be much more likely to read theologians in the Lutheran, Reformed, or Anglican traditions -- instead of reading broadly in the theologians who transcend specific Protestant communions. A final thread of conversation was whether the "big names" of Protestant theology can survive in an age of megachurches and church planting networks. The sponsor this time is Ethan's Donut Factory in downtown Hillsdale, Michigan.

The whole crew (D. G. Hart-Presbyterian, Korey Maas-Lutheran, and Miles Smith-Anglican) returns in this discussion of Miles's review of several recent books by evangelicals who left evangelicalism to become - you guessed it - exvangelicals. These books parallel the rise and fall of the Young Restless Reformed which was the subject of this article. These trends also coincide with the increase of Americans who qualify as "nonverts," that is, people who used to identify as some version of Christian and now consider themselves "none," as in having no religion. For those who consider the importance of institutions, especially for confessional Protestants with a high doctrine of the church, these trends present serious dilemmas for the ongoing ministry of word and sacrament through the agency of an institutional church (sometimes known as denomination). Confessional Protestants generally take denominational structures for granted even though since the rise of the megachurch (1990s), followed by social network forms of Christian cooperation and aspiration (Gospel Coalition and Acts 29, for example), more and more American Christians are unfamiliar with the institutional mechanisms for organizing ministry and belonging. What may be especially intriguing for those with ears to be intrigued is that the shelf-life of recent evangelical endeavors in church planting run out of steam and done so almost as fast (as they tell us) as the planet is heating up. Summer is too short for advertisements. But Twitter access is still available for Miles Smith @ivmiles and D. G. Hart @oldlife. Please do not bother Korey Maas. He has an academic department to run.

One reason for the appeal of Christian Nationalism - either in its current form or its 1980s Moral Majority version - is the loss of moral norms in the wider society. American Christians (Protestants more than Roman Catholics) functioned in their society relatively comfortably with generic Christian morality as the standard for public and private behavior. As a moral consensus has eroded (is Donald Trump up or down stream from Pride Month?), churches may need to be more intentional about the basics of Christian morality than they were in previous generations. This discussion among the co-hosts - D. G. Hart (Presbyterian), Korey Maas (Lutheran), and Miles Smith (Anglican) goes fairly deep into the weeds of preaching the law with the unexpected twist of the Lutheran leading the charge for application and moral exhortation in sermons. Later in the recording, the co-hosts also discuss the legitimacy of churches having a one-strike-and-you're-out policy for church officers who commit adultery through sexual sin. Is plagiarism in preaching as bad as adultery? Or do sexual offenses compromise a church officer's integrity in ways unlike other breaches of the moral law? Apologies to listeners for taking so long to post this recording. Hiccups in schedules and switching podcast platforms are partly to blame.

This relatively brief conversation is downstream from previous discussions and arguments about Christian Nationalism first at Reformed Forum and then at Presbycast. Dr. Miles Smith (Anglican) and D. G. Hart (Presbyterian) had the benefit this time of Dr. Korey Maas' (Lutheran) presence to function as the adult in the room. Topics ranged from the generational appeal of Christian Nationalism (boomers turn out to be reliable -- who knew?), the traction it receives among Lutherans in the LCMS, and the erosion of confidence or participation in civic and ecclesiastical institutions. The co-hosts did not have enough time for discussion of Miles Smith's forthcoming book which bears directly on the Christian, more precisely Protestant, character of American political institutions in the Early Republic. Listeners can follow Dr. Smith (@IVMiles) and Dr. Hart (@oldlife) on X (formerly Twitter). To keep up with Dr. Maas, follow him following his children.