The ReWork with Allison Tyler Jones

What happens when your passion for your work fades—but you still need to pay the bills?In this episode of The ReWork, I’m joined by educator and photographer Cris Duncan of CJ Duncan Photography for a candid conversation about what it takes to stay in love with your photography business for the long haul.Cris has been in business for over 20 years and has recently taken over as director of the famed Texas School. This annual photography education event attracts photographers from all over the world at every stage of their business.Cris and I discuss how the definition of success shifts over time—in his case, moving from volume and hustle to values and vision. Cris opens up about hitting burnout after years of saying “yes” to everything, and how he learned to reconnect with what he loves to shoot. We talk about hard choices that come with being in business for a long time: how to pivot without losing momentum, how to stay creative without burning out, and how to build a business that supports the life you want (instead of the other way around).If you've been in business for a while—or even just long enough to feel like you need a creative shift—this episode is your permission slip to reset, reimagine, and reignite your passion for your work.Episode Highlights:From Fetal Position to Fired Up. Cris shares the rollercoaster of studio life—one day soaring, the next in tears.Do the Work, Even When It’s Hard. Longevity comes from showing up, staying connected, and doing the grind.Execution Beats Ideas Every Time. Success isn’t about ideas, it’s about who takes action and iterates.The Goldman Sachs Reset. A 12-week program reignited Cris’s passion and gave him fresh tools.Prints Outlast Phones. Hard drives fail, printed portraits live on as family treasures.Key Takeaways:Reframing success: From high volume to high valueRecognizing burnout before it takes overLearning to say “no” without guiltMaking peace with doing different—not necessarily moreStaying curious as the key to creative longevityBuilding a business that evolves with youAbout Cris Duncan: a high-end portrait photographer from Lubbock, Texas, where he and his wife Dee run a successful studio specializing in families and high school seniors. With over 21 years in business, he has become a respected leader in the industry, recently taking on the role of Director of the Texas School of Professional Photography after serving as a student, volunteer, and instructor. Beyond his photography career, Cris is a Goldman Sachs 10,000 Small Businesses Program graduate, bringing fresh business insight and a passion for helping photographers grow through education and communityTune in to hear Cris Duncan share the real secrets to staying relevant, profitable, and passionate in photography after two decades and why his lessons matter for your business right now.Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links & Resources:Download a TranscriptAnything You Want by Derek SiversTexas School of Professional PhotographyFREE -Ultimate Client Consultation FormFREE -Frequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)FREE -Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesDo The ReWorkWebsite | Instagram | FacebookAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInCris Duncan - CjDuncan Photography& Texas School of Professional PhotographyWebsite 1 | Website 2 | Instagram 1 | Instagram 2

If offering albums feels overwhelming, too many sizes, too many cover options, too many edits, this episode is for you. In this conversation, ATJ sits down with Priscilla Klingler, owner of Vision Art albums to uncover a simpler, more profitable way to sell albums.Hint: it starts by reducing choices.You’ll learn how to design and present albums in a way that eliminates client decision fatigue, reduces your design time, and increases your average sale, all while elevating your brand. If you've ever thought, "Albums sound great, but I don't know where to start," this is the episode you've been waiting for.Episode Highlights:Why fewer choices = more sales: How simplifying your album offerings leads to more confident clients and faster decisionsStart with one: The exact formula for choosing one album size, one cover style, and one layout format to get startedDesign first, edit later: Why you should create and show a finished album before asking clients to make photo selectionsSet boundaries on edits: How to implement a quick approval process that protects your time and prevents project creepVendor matters: What to look for in an album company, from print quality and turnaround time to white-glove serviceEditorial-style storytelling: Tips for creating simple, timeless designs that let the images do the talkingPresentation is everything: The psychology behind how and when to show the album, and why it makes or breaks the saleKey Takeaways:Photographers must show albums if they want to sell them, clients can’t value what they never see.Price isn’t the real barrier; clients invest when they understand the emotional and legacy value of albums.Simplifying options (limiting sizes, covers, and designs) makes the sales process easier and helps photographers avoid overwhelm.Photographers should design and present albums themselves rather than waiting for clients to choose images, which prevents decision fatigue and speeds up salesAbout Priscilla Klingler: The Director of Vision Art Albums, where she helps photographers turn their work into timeless, heirloom-quality books. Known for her deep industry knowledge and hands-on guidance, she teaches photographers how to simplify their options, sell with confidence, and showcase albums as essential legacy pieces. Under her leadership, Vision Art has become a go-to partner for pros who want their clients to value printed art as much as digital files.Have you simplified your album offerings or are you still stuck in option overload? We want to hear about it. Tag us on Instagram @do.the.rework and tell us what your next step is after listening.Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links & Resources:Download a TranscriptVisionartSmartAlbumsFundy DesignerFREE -Ultimate Client Consultation FormFREE -Frequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)FREE -Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesDo The ReWorkWebsite | Instagram | FacebookAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInPriscilla Klingler - Vision ArtWebsite | Instagram

Do you find yourself stuck in repetitive tasks (aka death by 1000 cuts), buried under endless emails, or struggling to plan creative client sessions? In this illuminating episode, ATJ sits down with visionary photographer and AI expert Kira Derryberry to explore precisely how ChatGPT can transform your photography business. Discover how to clone your brain, automate daily tasks, visualize creative concepts effortlessly, and gain powerful insights into your business—all by harnessing the practical, innovative capabilities of AI.Don’t be left behind, AI is here and we all need to get on board. Kira will give us a place to begin.Episode Highlights:From Fear to Efficiency - Understand why integrating AI into your business is crucial, much like the transition from film to digital photography.ChatGPT as a Creative Partner - Discover practical ways Kira uses AI for client styling, mood boards, and concept visualizations, enhancing creative sessions.Business Insights at Your Fingertips - Learn how Kira leverages AI to analyze business performance, strategically plan growth, and even recover from setbacks.Your Personal Digital Assistant - Kira shares how ChatGPT helps handle challenging client communications, invoice follow-ups, and day-to-day business management tasks.Effective AI Prompting Techniques - Master the art of precise ChatGPT prompts to maximize its potential, streamline workflows, and save valuable time.Navigating AI Responsibly - Essential cautions and ethical considerations when using AI, including data security and maintaining your personal judgment.Key Takeaways:Learn to use AI effectively as your assistant, not your replacement.Discover how to ask better questions to unlock ChatGPT’s full potential.Gain practical examples of incorporating AI into both creative and administrative business aspects.About Kira Derryberry: Kira Derryberry, former president of Professional Photographers of America, combines her tech-savvy background with photography expertise, pioneering creative applications of AI in business. Her dynamic approach helps photographers tackle overwhelm, elevate productivity, and unlock creativity through practical AI strategies.Tune in to revolutionize your workflow and creativity with AI!Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links and Resources: Download a TranscriptBoss Level AI: Join Kira’s practical workshopsImaging USA Pre-Con with Kira DerryberryGet Your Shoot Together Podcast hosted by Kira Derryberry and Mary Fisk-TaylorUltimate Client Consultation FormFrequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesDo The ReWorkWebsite | Instagram | FacebookAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInKira DerryberryWebsite | Instagram | PPA

Be honest—do you ever feel like you are collecting money from your clients, just to hand it over to your vendors, or the tax man?You are NOT alone. It’s actually one of the most common struggles I hear from photographers.That’s why I’ve invited Venus Michael to the show. Venus is a bookkeeper who specializes in helping photographers stop the financial bleeding and finally take control of their money.In this episode, Venus and I dive into the real reasons you might feel broke, even when you’re fully booked—like wasting money on random props or pulling prices out of thin air based on what “everybody else” is charging.But here’s the good news—Venus makes understanding your money easy (and not boring, I promise). She breaks down:How to actually know what’s profit and what’s notWhy lumping all your money in one account is killing your cash flowAnd how opening just one extra account can change everything.We also dig into her favorite system—Profit First—a simple method that helps you divide every dollar into separate accounts for expenses, your pay, profit, and taxes.No more tax season panic. No more wondering where all the money went.Venus even shares how changing the way you see your money—like adjusting your camera lens—can help you make smarter decisions that support both your creativity and your bank account.If you’re ready to stop the cycle of making money and watching it disappear, you do not want to miss this episode.In this episode, you’ll learn:Why photographers tend to overspend on unnecessary stuff and undercharge for their workHow the Profit First method helps you manage your money without complicated spreadsheetsWhy tracking expense percentages and working with a creative-friendly accountant is a mustHow to get started today by opening one simple account to start keeping more of what you earnTimestamps:[3:00] Hear how Venus discovered her niche in bookkeeping for photographers in 2017 and wrote a book.[6:48] Portrait photographers often waste money on props and copy others' pricing without considering income goals.[9:07] Venus helps photographers with distinguishing necessary expenses from wants.[11:59] Using separate bank accounts for expenses simplifies financial management and prevents overspending.[14:42] ATJ reflects on how adopting the Profit First method prevented unexpected tax bills after profitable holiday seasons.[15:59] Financial preparedness changes tax bills from stressors to routine occurrences[18:07] Venus points out how, although skeptical at first, many CPAs use multiple accounts after seeing clients succeed financially.[20:58] Venus discusses viewing business finances as three roles—business, worker, and owner.[24:15] Hear how a client used Profit First to fund a passion project while still sustaining her photography business.[26:12] Shifting perspectives, like changing camera lenses, helps make better business decisions.[28:38] Hear how reducing expense percentages over time improves financial health.[31:53] Having a financial cushion for taxes reduces stress and allows surplus to become profit.[32:55] To accurately assess finances, Venus advises blocking time, calculating expenses, and avoiding working blindly.[34:34] Knowing the costs of goods helps guide decisions around pricing.[37:16] Many photographers also overlook labor costs, causing loss of profit.[38:06] Venus advises that calculating hourly worth requires factoring in experience, efficiency, and time spent per project.[41:29] ATJ points out how translating complex financial concepts into creative-friendly language helps photographers better understand profit.[44:16] Profit First Professionals offer bookkeeping support.[46:40] Venus argues that the first thing that you should do is outsource bookkeeping.[48:58] It's important to choose a bookkeeper with accounting expertise who offers value-based pricing, not hourly rates.[51:30] Prioritize bookkeeping services that handle payroll, sales tax, and reporting.[52:40] It's totally normal to feel vulnerable when hiring a bookkeeper, so find someone you trust and connect with.[55:12] ATJ recommends starting small with Profit First by setting aside 1% of your income to build financial stability.Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links and Resources: Download a TranscriptUltimate Client Consultation FormFrequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesVenus Michael - Profit First for PhotographersMike Michalowicz - Profit FirstJim Loehr - The Power of Full EngagementDo The ReWorkWebsite | Instagram | FacebookAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInVenus MichaelWebsite | Website 2 | Book | Instagram 1 | Instagram 2 | Facebook

Have you ever had a customer service experience so good you wanted to bottle it and recreate it in your own business?That’s what it’s like talking to Matthew Hodgman, Senior Client Success Manager at White House Custom Colour. While his title might sound corporate, Matt leads with heart—and serious empathy chops. If empathy were a competitive sport, he’d be on the podium with gold.We’re not talking about empathy as a feel-good bonus. We’re discussing empathy as a vital business essential. Empathy isn’t just about being a friendly human—it’s your secret weapon for building loyalty, diffusing tension, and turning client “oops” moments into opportunities.In this episode, Matt and I delve into what it really looks like to lead with empathy in business:Listen like you mean it—instead of just waiting to talk nextReach out before there’s a problem—not afterBuild genuine, lasting relationships with clients and vendors alikeHow to turn mistakes into your best marketing momentsAnd how to let empathy shape your pricing, policies, and processMatt even shares a story about WHCC stepping in to fix a problem that wasn’t even their fault—total masterclass in grace under pressure.If you want to create a business that feels good—for your clients, your partners, and yourself—this is the episode to tune into.What We Cover:Why empathy is a business skill, not just a personality traitActive listening that builds trustUnexpected outreach and why it mattersWhen things go wrong: How you handle it defines youWhat empathy has to do with pricing and flexibilityTimestamps:[2:43] Empathy isn't just nice to have; it’s vital in cutting through the negative noise to truly connect with others.[5:27] ATJ believes that human connection, not efficiency, makes the work meaningful, putting love into every image.[8:00] Matt asserts that value lies in the shared experience, not just the product.[10:02] Long-term vendor relationships can become authentic partnerships built around trust and support.[12:06] Matt explains how empathy at every level creates a ripple effect of positive collaboration.[15:51] Owning mistakes with grace and kindness can transform tension into loyalty.[17:24] Learn how some of the best marketing that you ever do in business is actually after something has gone very wrong.[19:18] Matt admires ATJ’s brand identity and empathetic approach to her business.[22:03] ATJ reflects on having built trust by empathizing with a reluctant teen and connecting with them over Sephora.[25:49] Matt stresses the need to match communication styles so that clients feel seen, heard, and respected.[28:12] ATJ prioritizes upfront transparency to avoid manipulative and/or uncomfortable situations later.[31:23] Every experience with a client is an opportunity to exceed expectations.Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links and Resources: Download a TranscriptUltimate Client Consultation FormFrequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesDo The ReWorkWebsite | Instagram | FacebookAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInWhite House Custom ColourWebsite | Instagram | Facebook | YouTube

What if I were to tell you that confidence in your business doesn’t come from booking more clients or getting that one huge sale, that it actually comes from having a solid process in place?​​Joining me for this episode to help me tackle this topic is my good friend and popular repeat guest Jeff Dachowski. We get real about this because it doesn't get talked about enough.Again, it is not about landing big sales or hoping for good luck; it’s about having processes that keep things running smoothly. Trust me, once I figured that out, everything clicked.We talk about how confidence in your business isn’t some magical thing you’re born with. No, it comes from having solid systems in place. No more panicking about no-shows or wondering how you’ll pull everything together.Jeff and I both realized that clear processes for everything from client calls to delivering the final product make things way more predictable and way less stressful. Trusting the process feels so much better than winging it every time.Here’s the thing, though - it’s so easy to fall into that whole imposter syndrome headspace, like, “Who am I to charge that much?”We’ve both had those moments, and we’re sharing how structure helped us kick imposter syndrome to the curb and actually build businesses that support our lives (and not the other way around). Listen in while Jeff and I chat through how to build a business that runs smoother and feels better. You might just start loving your systems.We talk about how:confidence comes from repeatable processes, not praise or talentclear systems and policies help overcome fear, guilt, and inconsistencyphotographers need to educate clients on the value of printed productsfocusing on legacy builds sustainable business and not just one-time digital salesstrong client relationships and one-on-one conversations often lead to long-term successTimestamps:[3:13] Jeff points out how many photographers feel torn between creative validation and profit.[6:34] Jeff’s confidence increased once he adopted repeatable systems that ensured quality.[9:26] Achieving success ultimately requires a defined strategy.[12:08] Jeff’s evolving business plan is grounded in consistent service and learning from failure and leads to lasting success.[15:57] ATJ states that educating clients and setting firm boundaries helps ensure that you're valued and fairly compensated.[18:26] By clearly differentiating his services early, Jeff leads his clients toward appreciating nontraditional offerings.[19:22] Jeff stresses offering custom wall portraits during sessions, turning casual prints into lasting displays.[22:38] In-person conversations reveal client needs and build trust, even before a portrait sale is secured.[25:06] ATJ asserts that confidence comes from highlighting unique value instead of justifying prices or mimicking other photographers.[29:18] Exceptional service leads to powerful word-of-mouth, as one portrait client brought $750,000 in referrals.[31:58] Jeff reframes print sales as emotional preservation, contrasting them with easily forgotten digital files.[34:31] We learn that Jeff prioritizes legacy over digital files, aiming to make portraits part of daily home life.[36:18] After the session, Jeff collaborates with clients to choose the perfect wall portrait.[39:59] Clients tend to feel more fulfilled when they receive tangible artwork and not just files.[40:42] Avoiding digital gallery overwhelm, ATJ now helps plan meaningful portraits with less stress.[43:36] Thoughtful decision-making, not instant agreement, is essential for lasting client relationships.[45:43] By offering a distinct luxury product, you attract fewer but more appreciative clients.[48:13] Fewer clients can still yield higher income when you offer exceptional service.[51:28] Jeff stresses discussing pricing changes to support both business needs and personal livelihood.[53:56] ATJ warns that skipping education or money talks can damage client trust and limit future opportunities.[55:25] Referrals and print sales, even small ones, are powerful tools for long-term growth.[58:50] Jeff urges photographers to always ask about prints, turning minor jobs into major profit.[1:01:33] Clients tend to appreciate options they didn’t know they had.[1:04:33] Rather than offering free sessions, Jeff stresses capturing family portraits before milestones shift everything.[1:07:26] Learn why Jeff prefers phone calls to in-person consultations.[1:10:39] ATJ, on the other hand, values in-person consults to build connection and clarify vision.Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links and Resources: Download a TranscriptUltimate Client Consultation FormFrequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesBooks:Go for No! Yes is the Destination, No is How You Get There by Richard Fenton & Andrea WaltzDo The ReWorkWebsite | Instagram | FacebookAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInJeff DachowskiWebsite | Instagram | Facebook | LinkedIn | PPA

As kind, accommodating portrait photographers, we seem wired to constantly ask ourselves, “How can I add more?”More services. More products. More options. More experience to my experience!Doesn’t adding MORE make it MORE VALUABLE to my client?What if adding more is actually costing you in ways you might not have considered?This week on The ReWork, I’m joined by Nicole Gates—former FBI agent turned full-time portrait photographer (yes, really)—who learned (the hard way) that more often leads to less…Less clarity. Less client connection. Which in turn leads to…More confusion. And yes—way more exhaustion and, finally back to LESS money in the bank. Nicole shares her journey from offering six hour portrait sessions with hair, makeup, multiple clothing changes to streamlining her process, simplifying her service, and creating more powerful, connected work.But we go deeper than that. Nicole also opens up about:Transitioning from a career where people avoided her (hello, FBI badge) to one where clients now seek her out.How her time in a male-dominated career fuels her mission to help women feel confident and strong in front of the camera—minus the cringe factor.The truth about imposter syndrome—and why being a bada** FBI agent didn’t stop her from feeling like a total fraud behind the lens.And how she finally stopped overcompensating in her sessions and started trusting her instincts.You'll laugh. You'll nod. You might even rethink everything you’re offering right now.Becaus, if you do it right?Less really can be more.We talk about:Why offering too much can overwhelm and confuse your clients making them reluctant to returnHow simplifying your process can lead to better photos and stronger client connectionsThe real reason we pile on “extras” (hint: it’s not confidence)What it means to build lasting relationships by going deeper, not widerIf you have ever felt like you’re throwing too much at the wall (in business or life) and wondering why it’s not sticking—this one is definitely for you.Timestamps:[3:26] At 55, Nicole started her business after retiring from the FBI, balancing multiple roles in McAllen, Texas.[6:02] Initially pursuing newborn photography, Nicole shifted to glamour portraits to empower women through confidence.[8:47] Nicole's FBI experience in trust-building and listening helps her create meaningful portraits.[10:27] Nicole guides women to embrace their strength and confidence, fostering a safe, empowering photoshoot experience.[13:13] Although she was initially against boudoir photography, Nicole now balances it with family shoots.[16:06] Nicole reflects on having overcome imposter syndrome, now trusting her photography skills without overcompensating.[19:03] Nicole's FBI career led her to inspiring local women.[21:49] Hear how Nicole learned to simplify, focus on relationships, and create lasting client experiences.[24:19] Nicole now shoots with intention, prioritizing quality over quantity.[27:44] Nicole came to embrace the idea that "less is more.”[30:33] Nicole sees her age as a badge of honor and embraces her style,[33:52] Striving for balance, Nicole is learning to work smarter while prioritizing family and personal growth.[36:57] Although she loves books, Nicole rarely finds time to read and favors watching Spanish dramas while editing.Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links and Resources: Download a TranscriptUltimate Client Consultation FormFrequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesJack Mitchell - Hug Your CustomersDo The ReWorkWebsite | Instagram | FacebookAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInNicole GatesWebsite | Instagram 1 | Instagram 2 | Instagram 3 | Facebook | Pinterest

“I had NO idea that you were SO EXPENSIVE!”“Can I get a refund (on the custom artwork that you just spent hours on)?”“I REALLY want just the digital files, why can’t you just do that?”If you own a business, you must get used to difficult conversations or you won’t be in business for long. It comes with the territory. Potential clients hear what they want to hear, don’t pay attention or you mess up and don’t give them the right info to begin with. No matter the cause, you are going to have days when you get an email something like this:“I’m bummed about the price. I average at least 3 professional photoshoots a year with various talented photographers and these would quite literally be the most expensive photos I have EVER purchased.”(actual email from prospective client)🤢GUT CLENCH, am I right? If you have ever had a client interaction that made you want to scream into a pillow - you are not alone.Joining me today to help us unpack her own difficult client conversations is adventure and hunting dog photographer Kristen Murray.Together we break down the conversations that leave us wondering:Do I stand my ground? Do I back down? And if I stand my ground, what do I say? What does that look like?Or, how we most often feel in these situations:Do I just quit and become a hermit?Listen in as Kristen shares a real and stressful experience with a client who disagreed with her over dog training methods, even going as far as calling her a bad dog mom? (Them’s fightin’ words!!!)Instead of letting things blow up, Kristen listened and held space for a differing perspective, and guess what? That client came back to her and hired her again.But wait, HOW?Kristen and I talk all about keeping your cool even when it might be difficult by setting boundaries without burning bridges. She offers up some fantastic advice to help us have the difficult convos and still protect our tender, creative souls.If you sometimes struggle with standing your ground while maintaining professionalism, this episode is definitely one you will not want to miss.In this episode, you will learn:how to handle difficult conversations by staying calm (even though you’re NOT at all CALM)the importance of respecting differing opinions and practices to improve client relationshipswhy you should avoid defensive reactions and instead respond thoughtfullywhy active listening (listening to understand rather than respond) is so importantthe positive effects of simplified pricing - breaking down pricing into smaller incrementsTimestamps:[2:55] Kristen travels nationwide, specializing in capturing the bond between adventurous dogs and their humans.[5:26] A near-death experience led Kristen to pursue dog photography full-time, leaving her previous job.[8:17] Kristen advises finding your passion and leaning into it, focusing on what you love and excel at.[9:30] Kristen learned to handle upset clients by staying calm and addressing issues thoughtfully.[11:51] After a tough conversation with an upset client, Kristen gained respect and even a potential referral.[14:38] Handling disagreement calmly gives you a superpower others often lack in business.[15:28] Kristen focuses on the bond between owners and their dogs, regardless of training methods or appearance.[16:55] ATJ values respecting differing opinions and creating an environment that celebrates differences.[19:49] Responding thoughtfully to criticism or apologies leads to resolution and de-escalation.[21:23] Kristen reflects on having remained calm, approaching a situation with respect to resolve the client's concerns.[24:36] Kristen believes people tend to avoid conflict, which worsens situations and leads to miscommunication, especially via email.[25:34] Difficult conversations aren’t always negative, and listening helps lessen tension and misunderstanding.[27:50] Kristen realized that smaller price increments and a personalized approach reduce client stress.[29:49] Kristen suggests starting with a customized approach and acting quickly.[32:19] ATJ suggests that expressing opinions confidently, without fear of confrontation, helps find good solutions.[34:28] Kristen appreciates a flexible approach to business, adjusting when needed.[36:10] ATJ commends Kristen for staying true to herself and adapting what she learns to her business.Click here to listen!WE WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU’D: Rate, Review, & Follow Us on Apple Podcasts“I love ATJ & The ReWork!.” <– If that sounds like you, please take a minute and rate and review the show! This helps us support more portrait photographers — just like you — move toward building the PROFITABLE, sustainable businesses that they really want. Click here, scroll to the bottom, tap to rate with five stars, and select “Write a Review.” Then be sure to let ME know what you loved most about the episode (and any topics you are dying to learn about). Also, if you haven’t already, FOLLOW the podcast. We’ll be adding some bonus episodes to the feed this season, and if you’re not following, you’ll miss out. Follow now!You can also email me directly with your suggestions at: support@dotherework.com - OR DM me directly on Instagram @atjphoto or @do.the.rework We’d love to hear your thoughts, suggestions and ideas! Links and Resources: Download a TranscriptUltimate Client Consultation FormFrequently Asked Difficult Questions (FADQ’s)Sales Sabotage Evaluation ToolAllison Tyler Jones Education CoursesDo The ReWorkWebsite | InstagramAllison Tyler JonesWebsite | Instagram | LinkedInKristen MurrayWebsite1 | Website2 | Instagram1 | Instagram2 | Facebook1 | Facebook2