
FOSIL, Education and School Libraries
by Elizabeth Hutchinson
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On the show
From 12 epsHost
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Recent episodes
Inquiry as Conversation: Who Does the Thinking?
Sep 1, 2026
49m 45s
What Happens When We Let Students Wonder?
Aug 25, 2026
52m 35s
Inquiry as Conversation: FOSIL, School Libraries and the Future of Learning
Aug 3, 2026
58m 52s
Four Domains of Thought (Part 2): Information and the Ability to Think
Jul 13, 2026
37m 04s
Four Domains of Thought (Part 1): Ideas and Images
Jul 6, 2026
51m 15s
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| Date | Episode | Topics | Guests | Brands | Places | Keywords | Sponsor | Length | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 9/1/26 | Inquiry as Conversation: Who Does the Thinking? | In Part 2 of our conversation with Gabrielle Mace, we continue exploring the ideas behind Teaching Inquiry as Conversation. You can listen to Part 1 here.This time, we ask a deceptively simple question: who is actually doing the thinking?We explore what it means for students to construct knowledge rather than simply acquire information; why changing our minds in response to evidence is an important part of inquiry; and what happens when teachers provide so much support that they begin doing the intellectual work for students.We also consider how generative AI changes the information environment, and why the role of the school librarian in developing increasingly independent inquirers may matter more than ever.And, as usual, the conversation leaves us with more questions than answers.These are the questions that Gabrielle posed… 1. Inquiry as conversationA central proposition of Inquiry as Conversation is that inquiry is fundamentally conversational: with ideas, information, other people and ourselves.What becomes possible when we understand inquiry in this way, rather than primarily as a process students move through?Reference: Chapter 2, p. 15-222. From research process to knowledge construction When Barbara discusses the development of her model, she describes a shift from a research-driven process model towards an inquiry model grounded in constructivism and social constructivism, where learners actively construct knowledge through their experiences and interactions rather than simply acquire information.What changes in our teaching when we genuinely understand inquiry as knowledge construction rather than information acquisition? And what does the social dimension of constructivism add to that process?Reference: Chapter 3, p. 31-353. Revision, evidence and intellectual humilityOne idea in the book that particularly interests me is the changing relationship between the inquirer and what they think they know. In my own inquiry design, I deliberately use new evidence that can destabilise an earlier, perfectly plausible interpretation. Darryl and Barbara discuss ‘adaptability and resilience’ and the dynamic nature of inquiry requires this mindset.Is the willingness for students to say “I may have been wrong” and to reconstruct understanding when the evidence demands it, an essential disposition of genuine inquiry?Reference: Chapter 4, p.494. Where does inquiry reside?The book has made me think about where the intellectual work of inquiry actually resides. In The Student Detective, I deliberately create a bounded, curated information environment so that students can spend more of their time reading closely, evaluating evidence, making connections, discussing competing interpretations and constructing and revising explanations rather than formal research.How do you think about the relationship between information-seeking and these other dimensions of inquiry? Are there different ways of designing the information environment depending on the kind of inquiry thinking we are trying to develop?5. Inquiry in the age of generative AIThe book’s argument feels particularly urgent in an environment where generative AI can provide an immediate, fluent answer and potentially remove much of the productive struggle involved in inquiry. At the same time, AI makes questions of authority, evidence, interpretation and reliability even more important.Does inquiry as conversation become more important, rather than less, in an AI-rich information environment?6. Instructional mindset and the gradual release of skillsIn the chapter on Teaching the Skills and Attitudes of Inquiry, you and Barbara argue that before we plan instruction, we need to clarify our own instructional mindset - including what we want students to understand, how we teach through conversation rather than delivery, and ultimately how we enable students to become independent learners. You also draw on the Gradual Release of Responsibility, where the cognitive work shifts from teacher-driven, to shared, and ultimately to student-driven.What does that gradual release look like in genuine inquiry? How do we know when we’re providing the scaffolding students need, and when we’re actually doing too much of the intellectual work for them?Reference: Chapter 8, p.105 - 106We didn’t get to this next question, so we will be discussing it in our next episode.7. Reading as inquiry conversationYours and Barbara’s concept of inquiry as conversation has made me think differently about reading. I’ve been observing what happens when students need to read because they genuinely need the information to resolve uncertainty, including voluntarily returning to something they’ve already read because new evidence has changed its possible meaning.Do you see reading itself as an inquiry conversation, and are reading and inquiry more deeply connected than we sometimes acknowledge in schools?LinksThe Student Detective - A structured inquiry experience that transforms the way students read, think and collaborate.Teaching Inquiry as a Conversation: Bringing Wonder to Life by Darryl Toerien and Barbara StriplingThanks for listening to FOSIL, Education and School Libraries! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 49m 45s | ||||||
| 8/25/26 | What Happens When We Let Students Wonder? | In this episode, we’re joined by Gabrielle Mace to explore the connections between deep reading, inquiry and the school library. We discuss Gabrielle’s work developing immersive inquiry experiences, the ideas in Teaching Inquiry as a Conversation, and what it means to create a culture of inquiry in schools. Along the way, we explore curiosity, conversation, student agency and the important role school librarians can play in helping students become thoughtful, independent learners.LinksThe Student Detective - A structured inquiry experience that transforms the way students read, think and collaborate.Teaching Inquiry as a Conversation: Bringing Wonder to Life by Darryl Toerien and Barbara Stripling This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 52m 35s | ||||||
| 8/3/26 | Inquiry as Conversation: FOSIL, School Libraries and the Future of Learning | In this episode of FOSIL, Education and School Libraries, Darryl and I are joined by Barbara Stripling to explore how inquiry learning can transform school libraries, the connections between the Stripling Model of Inquiry and FOSIL, and why conversation is central to meaningful learning.Drawing on Barbara’s 50 years of experience in school libraries and their co-authored book Teaching Inquiry as a Conversation, Barbara and Darryl discuss how inquiry moves beyond finding information towards questioning, reflection, meaning-making and personal growth.Together, they explore the connections between the Stripling Model of Inquiry and FOSIL, the importance of helping students develop their own thinking, and how school libraries can nurture curious, independent and reflective learners.The conversation also considers what inquiry means in today’s world of information abundance and AI, and why the process of thinking may be just as important as the outcome.Links:Teaching Inquiry as a conversation by Barbara Stripling and Darryl Toerien https://www.bloomsbury.com/uk/teaching-inquiry-as-conversation-9798216397021/The FOSIL Group Website https://fosil.org.uk/Empire State Information Fluency Continuum Skills Page https://nycdoe.libguides.com/skills/skillshome Two major FOSIL Group Topics on reading/ deep reading:* Oakham T&L Workshop 2021 | Reading for Inquiry Learning (FOSIL presentation)* Reading for Inquiry Learning, especially from this post onwards This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 58m 52s | ||||||
| 7/13/26 | cognitionintentionality+5 | — | — | — | cognitioninformation+6 | — | 37m 04s | ||
| 7/6/26 | cognitionintentionality+4 | — | Duke UniversityUnited States National Advisory Commission on Libraries+1 | — | cognitionintentionality+5 | — | 51m 15s | ||
| 6/1/26 | school librarianshipeducation+4 | — | TolkienInquiry: An Educational and Moral Imperative+4 | — | school librarianseducation+6 | — | 43m 04s | ||
| 5/9/26 | Generative AIInquiry-based learning+3 | Darrly Toerien | SJSUALiVE Library+2 | — | Generative AIinquiry+6 | — | 50m 57s | ||
| 4/20/26 | Generative AIInquiry-based learning+3 | Darrly Toerien | BBCThe AI School Librarian | — | Generative AIFOSIL+5 | — | 47m 23s | ||
| 3/23/26 | Generative AIInquiry-based learning+3 | Darrly Toerien | BBCPedagogy of the Oppressed+2 | — | Generative AIschool libraries+4 | — | 48m 29s | ||
| 3/2/26 | generative AIinquiry-based learning+4 | — | Attention, Availability, and the Reading of BooksFinding Your Voice in a Ventriloquist’s World – AI and Writing+2 | — | generative AIeducation+5 | — | 39m 03s | ||
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| 2/23/26 | purpose of educationschool libraries+3 | Darryl Toerien | Blanchelande CollegeAI: The perfect storm that rages against the evolving dynamism through which we form ourselves as human beings | — | educationschool libraries+3 | — | 33m 43s | ||
| 12/20/25 | FOSILbooks+3 | Darryl | Institute of Advancement of Inquiry | — | FOSILbooks+6 | — | 23m 03s | ||
| 7/19/25 | inquiry learningschool libraries+3 | — | AKS LythamFOSIL | — | inquiry learningFOSIL+3 | — | 42m 35s | ||
| 4/23/25 | inquiry learningschool libraries+4 | — | FOSIL GroupLearning Hub+2 | — | inquiry-based educationschool librarians+3 | — | 33m 18s | ||
| 1/25/25 | FOSIL Symposiuminquiry-based learning+3 | Ruth MaloneyJannath Khanom | FOSIL GroupFocus on Inquiry: A Teacher’s Guide to Implementing Inquiry-based Learning | — | FOSILSymposium+6 | — | 50m 04s | ||
| 12/2/24 | Are you Teaching Research Skills or Inquiry? | Engaging and Empowering School Libraries, a general school library podcast, and FOSIL, Education and School Libraries, a podcast that focuses on teaching through inquiry, came together this month. This session brought my two co-hosts together to discuss how school librarians can move on from teaching single research lessons to inquiry lessons, even if that is all they are being asked to do. This show includes pictures of the FOSIL cycle and FOSIL skillset both of which can be found and downloaded from here... https://fosil.org.uk/fosil-cycle/ Engaging and Empowering School Libraries Membership - https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/aboutmembershipIf you wish to watch the Youtube recording of this discussion you can find it here No AI was used to create this podcast, as you will spot by the human mistakes we make... enjoy! This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 56m 02s | ||||||
| 10/26/24 | Redefining the Role of School Libraries in Education | This episode explores the librarian’s evolving role in education, sharing practical strategies for fostering collaboration between teachers and librarians to create meaningful, student-centered inquiry experiences. We discuss recent publications, success stories from classrooms, and offer a preview of the upcoming FOSIL book, aiming to redefine how libraries contribute to holistic, impactful education.As always we would love to hear your thoughts on this episode.Links:* Re/Dis-Covering the Promise of Freedom Through Inquiry: Part 1, by Darryl Toerien and Lee FitzGerald for ACCESS (Volume 38, Issue 3, September 2024), the journal of the Australian School Library Association (ASLA). Aimed at principals, SLT and classroom-based teachers.* First SLA Blog post in FOSIL Group Forum: Between the Library and the Classroom: Becoming Integral to the Educational Process 2.1* “As We Begin, So Shall We Go”: FOSIL as Means to a “Transcendent and Honourable End”, by Darryl Toerien for Synergy (Volume 22, Number 1, June 2024), the journal of the School Library Association of Victoria (SLAV).Maritain quote: "Nothing is more important than the events which occur within that invisible universe which is the mind of [a person]. And the light of that universe is knowledge. If we are concerned with the future of civilization we must be concerned primarily with a genuine understanding of what knowledge is, its value, its degrees, and how it can foster the inner unity of the human being" (The Range of Reason, 1952, p. 3).Engaging and Empowering School Libraries is a membership that aims to support school librarians in teaching through inquiry. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 39m 13s | ||||||
| 9/14/24 | Breakthrough moments: Year 9 signature work inquiry | The work on FOSIL continues with Darryl practising what he preaches. Is this something we can all take and use or is it just great for him because he has been steeped in it for so long? Listen to his inspiring journey and be encouraged by his confidence that all school librarians can do this too. FOSIL Group Website - https://fosil.org.uk/Re/Dis-covering the promise of freedom through inquiry - https://fosil.org.uk/newsroom/article-asla-access-7/ Engaging and Empowering School Libraries Membership - https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/aboutmembership This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 44m 02s | ||||||
| 7/13/24 | FOSIL, Education and School Libraries a New Year... Looking Ahead | FOSIL, Education and School Libraries is a podcast that aims to encourage and support you to think of school libraries in a different way. We hope to develop your understanding of the value of school libraries, help you engage with the content on the FOSIL Group Website, introduce you to people who are using FOSIL and most of all just have a conversation about the role of school librarians within education.If you are looking for my Engaging and Empowering School Libraries Podcast you can find that here https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/podcastToday Darryl and I look forward to what our new year of podcasting will bring, including:- Updates on Blanchelande projectsWorking with UK SLAPublished ArticlesBooks… to be writtenConferences - including an announcement of a FOSIL gathering - February 2025Strategic PartnersBlanchelande Yr 1 tourist brochure https://gsy.bailiwickexpress.com/gsy/news/written-children-children/BBC Report https://www.facebook.com/share/r/8EvX1rx5PVyre5SK/ This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 45m 10s | ||||||
| 5/28/24 | Celebrating our First Year with Your Questions. | In this episode, hosts Darryl and Elizabeth celebrate their first year of podcasting about FOSIL, Education and School Libraries.After concluding a two-part history of school libraries last month, we decided to dedicate this session to answering listener questions. We began by addressing concerns about the IFLA School Library Guidelines and their relevance today, discussing the importance of adapting these guidelines to local and national contexts.We also look into how school librarians can balance inquiry-based learning with other responsibilities, emphasising the need to integrate core instructional activities into an inquiry-centered framework. The conversation then shifted to the role of school librarians in supporting their school's strategic development plans and how to align library missions with broader educational goals.Questions about the impact of artificial intelligence on academic integrity and the future challenges and opportunities it presents for school librarians are discussed and we finally, explore the historical development of school librarianship in America, Australia, and the UK, and speculate on the potential changes a new UK government might bring to the sector.Doctorow: Even if you think AI search could be good, it won't be good (15 May 2024).Engaging and Empowering School Libraries Membership -https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/aboutmembership This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 45m 04s | ||||||
| 4/27/24 | The History of School Libraries 1986-2024: Part 2 | In the second part of our history of school libraries, we talk more about the evolution of school libraries from 1986 to the present day. We continue to focus on Norman Beswick's history of school libraries as an influential piece of research from the same period, which looked at the dramatic trajectory of librarianship, budget struggles, and changing roles with the advent of computers in education.We explore two crucial hopeful signals during that time - the rise of information skills and the increasing collaboration between teachers and librarians. The discussion also touches upon the concept of information literacy and how it differs from the inquiry model. Additionally, we critically examine Anne Irving's nine-question steps model from 1985 that set a new tone for the synergy between teachers and librarians.Our conversation highlights the role of school librarians in teaching information literacy skills, the difficult struggle for curriculum time, and the undeniable link between information literacy and education. We touch upon the internet’s impact, the devaluation of school libraries and the challenge of teaching information literacy amidst these changes. We discuss how a focus on information availability may have hindered a smooth transition during the introduction of computers to schools.The episode creates an understanding of the evolution of school libraries, touches on the impacts of AI, and the need for diverse, multicultural teaching methods. It emphasises librarians' role in diversifying teaching methods and portrays libraries, beyond academic learning centres, as hubs for personal development, independent learning, and more. We conclude by reemphasising the importance for school libraries and librarians to align their educational philosophy with the current concerns and aspirations in the educational sector.Portraits of an Engaged and Empowered Inquirer https://fosil.org.uk/forums/topic/portraits-of-an-engaged-and-empowered-inquirer/Membership Information https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/aboutmembership This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 51m 12s | ||||||
| 4/13/24 | The History of School Libraries from 1937 -1986. Part 1 | In this episode, we delve into the rich history of school libraries and their crucial role in education and discuss various significant developments in school libraries over the years. We take a time-travelling journey, beginning at the inception of the School Library Association in 1937 to the progressive education era, illuminating the relentless evolution of school libraries. From the past, we make connections to the present and future, underlining the transformative journey of school librarianship in relation to education and philosophy. The underlying tone of our discussion revolves around employing academic honesty and fostering intellectual curiosity among students.The latter section considers the historical schism in the School Library Association and the changes in the focus of school libraries over time. We discuss the traditional and progressive approaches to education and their influence on library usage habits. The evolution from school libraries being mere conduits for recreational reading to valuable resources for independent learning is explored.Experience the journey of educational reform, from traditional to progressive, and witness the increasing prominence given to school libraries. Learn about the UK's unique path in teacher librarianship and the potential promise of introducing microcomputers into school libraries during the 1980s. Embrace the past, understand the present, and envisage the future as we delve into the world of school libraries and their profound implications for education. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 52m 12s | ||||||
| 3/9/24 | Empowering Education: The Vital Role of School Libraries | In this episode, we discuss the evolving role of school libraries within the broader educational system. Addressing pressing issues such as the undervaluation of librarians and the alignment of library programs with institutional educational goals, this conversation underscores the library's essential contribution to student development.With a focus on the IFLA School Library Guidelines, we also navigated the challenges of aligning libraries with the quantifiable outcomes often prioritised by schools. By examining strategies for librarians to articulate and advocate for their role in supporting holistic education, this episode presents a compelling call to action for educational leaders and librarians alike. Listen in as we explore the critical intersection of education, purpose, and the pivotal role of school libraries in shaping informed, curious, and well-rounded individuals.Membership information https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/aboutmembership This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 40m 12s | ||||||
| 2/3/24 | School Libraries Uncovered: Aligning with Guidelines and Enhancing Non-Fiction Collections | In our last podcast, Darryl and I talked about Douglas Knight’s two major and unique functions of a library and ended up having a great discussion about the purpose and function of our non-fiction collections.In this episode, we chat about:-* The similarities with the SLA guidelines, including their bookstock guidance. Stott (1947, 1955), School Libraries: A Short Manual (CUP for SLA) and SLA (1972) | Libraries in Secondary Schools* Understand the role of the school librarian via the IFLA School Library Guidelines* Staffing in school libraries* Collection development and in particular non-fiction. Making School Libraries Integral to the Educational Process https://www.sla.org.uk/Services/ItemDetail?iProductCode=8340&Category=GUIDELINESMembership information -https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/aboutmembership Last month's podcast https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/podcast/episode/adf7b60a/fosil-education-and-school-libraries-7 This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 40m 51s | ||||||
| 1/13/24 | Unbounded Minds: Libraries as Catalysts for Idea Generation | In this episode, Darryl and I continue our conversation about Douglas Knight’s ideas about a library's two major and unique functions, regardless of type. These two functions are:- * First, it makes possible meetings of mind and ideas not limited by our normal boundaries of time, space, and social or economic level.* To say this is to suggest the second great function of a library. It is the institution in our society that allows and encourages the development and extension of ideas -- not their passive absorption, but their active generation. … The technical means of his encounter may be a record, a tape, a film, a print-out or -- most radical of all -- a book. Libraries are not bounded by means; they will and should employ any means to achieve their ends.Clarification on non-fiction to fiction ratio: NF to F ratio should rise from 50% NF to 50% F through 66% NF to 33% F to 75% NF to 25% F as children move from Primary through Secondary (Darryl)The link to Douglas Knight's document can be found here https://bit.ly/3ShxMSK Podcast - Non-fiction collections in school libraries: Do we still need them?https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/podcast/episode/9d8adc04/non-fiction-collections-in-school-libraries-do-we-still-need-them FOSIL forum link -https://fosil.org.uk/forums/ Engaging and Empowering School Libraries Membership -https://www.elizabethahutchinson.com/aboutmembership This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit elizabethhutchinson.substack.com | 41m 05s | ||||||
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