Grief Out Loud

What happens when grief isn't an exception, but a constant presence? In this episode, Jana talks with researcher and educator Nora Gross about her book, Brothers in Grief: The Hidden Toll of Gun Violence on Black Boys and Their Schools, which follows the two years she spent embedded in a Philadelphia boys' high school where students were grieving repeated losses from gun violence. Through interviews, observation, and simply showing up, Nora witnessed how grief shapes friendships, school life, ideas about the future, and the social constraints Black boys face when it comes to grief. Nora also shares how her own experiences of grief - including the death of her mother from cancer while Nora was finishing her Ph.D. program and the deaths of three students in her first year of teaching—influenced the questions she researched and continue to shape her understanding of grief today. We discuss: How cumulative loss changes young people's expectations for the future. Why grief often remains invisible in schools, even when nearly everyone has experienced loss. The unique pressures Black boys face around expressing - and not expressing - emotion. The difference between the "easy hard," the "hard hard," and the "hidden hard" phases of communal grief, particularly in a school setting. Why curiosity, rather than fixing, may be one of the most powerful ways we can support young people who are grieving. How listening deeply can become an act of care. Nora Gross is a sociologist of youth, race, and education and a documentary filmmaker. She is Assistant Professor of Education at Barnard College, Columbia University and received her PhD from the University of Pennsylvania in Sociology and Education. Nora uses qualitative, multimodal, and participatory methods to understand the ways youth develop and protect their inner lives in the face of external constraints. She has published on issues related to racialized masculinity for both Black and white boys, grief and loss, political polarization in schools, teens' social media use, youth resistance and emotional solidarity, and school supports for vulnerable youth. She has also produced several documentary films focusing on the lives of Black boys and men. Nora is the author of the award-winning ethnographic book, Brothers in Grief: The Hidden Toll of Gun Violence on Black Boys and Their Schools (University of Chicago Press, 2024), as well as co-editor of Care-Based Methodologies: Reimagining Qualitative Research with Youth in US Schools (Bloomsbury Academic, 2022). You can learn more at www.noragross.com & https://www.brothersingrief.com/

How do you talk with children about death, dying, and grief - especially when the truth feels impossible to say? Most adults feel unprepared to tell a child that someone in their life has an advanced serious illness or has died. There's often a deep desire to protect kids from pain, avoid overwhelming them, or wanting to wait until there's a "better" time to talk. But children often already sense that something has changed. In this episode, Jana is joined by Dougy Center colleagues Rebecca Hobbs-Lawrence, M.A. and Sat Kaur Khalsa, M.S.W. to talk about how adults can approach these conversations with honesty, clarity, and compassion. Rebecca, Dougy Center's Pathways Program and Grief Services Coordinator, and Sat Kaur, Dougy Center's Family Services Coordinator, bring decades of professional experience supporting grieving children and families. They also share how their own childhood experiences of grief shaped the way they talk with kids about loss today. Together, they explore how to tell children someone has died using concrete, age-appropriate language, why grief conversations don't need to happen all at once, and how adults can respond when children ask difficult questions about blame, uncertainty, and why someone died. They also discuss how to talk with children about deaths that are often stigmatized, including suicide, homicide, and substance-related deaths, and why withholding information can sometimes create more fear and confusion. Whether you're a parent, caregiver, clinician, educator, or simply someone supporting a those who are grieving, this conversation offers practical guidance and reassurance for navigating some of the hardest conversations. We discuss: Why honesty and clear language matter when talking with kids about death How to explain death in concrete, age-appropriate ways Why grief conversations are never one-and-done Supporting children when someone has an advanced serious illness How to respond when kids blame themselves for a death Talking about suicide, homicide, and substance-related deaths without shame Why adults don't need perfect words - just presence and openness Resources: Dougy Center's full collection of Tip Sheets and Activities: https://www.dougy.org/grief-support-resources Grief education & training offerings: https://www.dougy.org/professionals-trainings

In December of 2021, Sawyer was halfway through their final year of college in a world that was still reeling from the pandemic. Home for the holidays, Sawyer got the heartbreaking news that their older brother, Jason, had died by suicide - a before-and-after moment that continues to reverberate today. Sawyer shares their nuanced perspective on grief, delving into how mental health, incarceration, and other systemic barriers impacted Jason's life and death. We also explore how the phrase, "It's not your fault," while well-intentioned, can leave little space for those who are grieving to truly reckon with both guilt and regret. We discuss: Jason's artistry, love of cars, and enduring pride in Sawyer's academic accomplishments Navigating grief while finishing college and graduating The intersection of grief and institutional failures, including incarceration, a lack of stable housing, and inadequate mental health support How peer support - both formal and informal - gave Sawyer space to reckon with both grief and guilt The power of logistical support to help those who are grieving If you or someone you know is struggling, please reach out. You can call 988, the National Crisis Line, or text HELLO to 741-741. Other resources include: The Trevor Project for LGBTQ+ youth (1-866-488-7386) and BlackLine (1-800-604-5841). Resources Mentioned: Wild Grief - Grieving Together in Nature Dougy Center - Resources for Young Adults If you want to learn more about supporting children and teens who are grieving, sign up for our online courses here: https://classes.dougy.org/

In this episode of Grief Out Loud, Jana is joined by N'keya Peters-Camille, LCSW, RYT® 200, a social worker, certified Grief Yoga teacher, facilitator for e-motion grief meet ups, and creator of Hope: A One Line A Day Journal for the Bereaved. N'keya shares the story of her mother, Hope - a woman she describes as her soulmate - who died of pancreatic cancer in 2021 at the age of 46. N'keya reflects on growing up alongside her mother, witnessing her overcome immense challenges, and experiencing firsthand what it meant to be deeply seen, supported, and loved. After her mother's death, N'keya found herself navigating grief without strong cultural or community rituals to hold her. In response, she created her own network of support through grief counseling, retreats, movement practices, and eventually, offering those same resources to others - particularly within her Afro-Caribbean and African American communities. The conversation explores caregiving during the pandemic, the absence of end-of-life conversations, and what it means to grieve while parenting young children. N'keya shares how she spoke honestly with her three-year-old son about death, how grief continues to evolve five years later, and how she makes space for both sorrow and joy - especially on complex days like Mother's Day. N'keya also speaks candidly about pregnancy loss and infertility following her mother's death and how those grief experiences intersected. She describes how her mother's voice continues to guide her—in her work, her parenting, and her sense of self—and how she honors that connection by living fully, while also deeply grieving. Note: this episode mentions childhood sexual assault. Please take care while listening. In this episode, you'll hear about: Grieving the death of a parent while raising young children The impact of limited cultural grief rituals and creating your own Movement, community, and storytelling as grieving practices Navigating Mother's Day while holding multiple losses Pregnancy loss, infertility, and layered grief experiences Maintaining an ongoing bond with someone who has died N'keya Peters-Camille, LCSW, RYT® 200, is a Social Worker and Grief Educator who integrates clinical support with somatic healing. Her work is deeply rooted in her own grief history—from navigating the death of her beloved mother, Hope, to the profound challenges of miscarriage and the complexities of IVF and IUI. As an African American woman born and raised in Brooklyn with Caribbean roots, N'keya is dedicated to bringing meaningful grief support to her community. Certified in Grief Yoga, she believes that grief is often too heavy to carry alone and too deep to process through words alone. In addition to her private practice, she serves as a volunteer with E-Motion, facilitating 6–8 week grief movement groups. By blending clinical social work with somatic movement and meditation, N'keya provides a "soft landing" for those walking the path of loss—helping them bridge the gap between mind and body, find their breath again, and carry their loved ones' legacies forward. Want to learn more about supporting children and teens who are grieving? Sign up for our online courses here: https://classes.dougy.org/

In the fall of 2023, Mackenzie Galloway-Cole was living out her rom-com-worthy love story with her wife Megan in New York City. Then, on an ordinary night in November, Megan collapsed and died a few hours later from a sudden cardiac event. In the aftermath, Mackenzie had to find her way in this newly shattered world without Megan, her anchor and biggest cheerleader. Mackenzie reflects on the shock of becoming a young widow, the added layers of grief that come with queer partner loss, and the painful realities of navigating death care systems that often default to heteronormative assumptions. Together, Jana and Mackenzie talk about the isolating nature of sudden and unexplained death, the importance of finding people who "get it," and the ways time itself becomes a particularly painful aspect of grief. Mackenzie also shares why New Year's can feel like a uniquely brutal grief milestone, how absence accumulates as life continues, and how Megan's love still shapes the way she takes care of herself today. This conversation holds space for heartbreak, dark humor, love stories, and the not-so-quiet ways grief rewires daily life - especially when the person you most want to turn to is the one who died. In this episode, we discuss: The story of how Megan and Mackenzie met and fell in love Sudden death and the trauma of an ordinary day turning catastrophic The intersection of being a young, gay widow Navigating hospitals, funeral homes, and death administration as a queer spouse Why the small, everyday moments can hurt more than the big ones How the second Christmas can feel even harder than the first New Year's as a "sneaky" grief holiday How the choices you make in life can reflect and honor your person who died Mackenzie Galloway-Cole writes about grief at Good Gay Grief on Substack and can also be found on Instagram at @deadwifeclub

When Kyndal Parks' grandfather died on Black Friday - the day after Thanksgiving – she lost one of her biggest supporters and confidants. While navigating her grief, Kyndal was also navigating life as a college student where she often felt unseen in her grief by faculty and the wider institution. What began as a class assignment turned into a powerful audio piece about loss, legacy, and the urgent need for grief-informed spaces on college campuses, particularly at HBCUs where collective trauma, silence, and resilience intertwine. In this conversation, Kyndal shares about her grandfather's extraordinary life - from his childhood in the 1940s, to living with a disability, to his time as a Black Panther, a gardener, a traveler, and the steady source of love that shaped her into the person she is today. She talks about the traditions they built together, how her grief shows up even from 2,000 miles away, and why vulnerability and community care are essential if we want to build environments where students who are grieving feel supported. Kyndal also explores the cultural and historical patterns of grief in Black communities, the pressure to "push through," and her vision for a world where grief is met with connection, not silence. We discuss: What made Kyndal's grandfather such an influential figure How his death reshaped her understanding of family, holidays, and identity What grief looked like at her college, and within her family and community Why she created her audio piece and what she hopes listeners take from it The need for vulnerability, community support, and grief-informed care at HBCUs and beyond How her grandfather continues to guide her today Check out News Ambassadors, the program that helped connect us with Kyndal and her audio piece.

When Cassie arrived at Dougy Center for her first peer grief support group for young adults after her dad died, she sat in the parking lot wondering if she could even walk inside. When she did, she found people her age who understood what it meant to have a parent die - people who would end up shaping her life in ways she never imagined. In this episode, Cassie talks about how grief changed her, what it was like to find community in a peer support group, and how those friendships continue to support her years later. Now, as a volunteer facilitator in a peer grief support group for children, Cassie reflects on what it means to come full circle - turning the care she received into care she now offers others. We Discuss: The early days and weeks after her dad's death How grief can be physically painful Finding connection and laughter in a support group Building lifelong friendships with people who "get it" Learning to make space for grief on purpose The importance of rituals and traditions What it's like to return as a volunteer to support children who are grieving The unexpected gifts of friendship Cassie's discovered in grief Learn more about Dougy Center's peer grief support groups and resources for Young Adults ages 18-40.

When Leena Magdi's younger brother, Hamoodi, was killed, her world shifted entirely. In her debut book Mourning Air, Leena explores how grief reshapes identity, faith, and love. In this conversation, Leena shares what it meant and means to be Hamoodi's sister, how sibling grief is often dismissed, and how writing helps her navigate the grief. Leena also shares about her family's forced displacement after war broke out in Sudan less than a year after Hamoodi's death - and how she's learning to grieve both her brother and her home. We discuss: What it means to be a sister after a sibling dies The invisibility of sibling grief Finding connection through spirituality and writing Grieving a home and a country - and the additional losses her family experienced in fleeing to Egypt from Sudan after war broke out How Leena stays connected to Hamoodi About Leena Magdi: Leena Magdi is a Sudanese-American writer and poet, author of Mourning Air, and mother of two. She was born in Sudan, raised in California, and currently lives in Egypt. You can find her on Instagram @xleenamagdix and TikTok @xleenamagdix.