
The Modern Therapist's Survival Guide with Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy
by Curt Widhalm, LMFT and Katie Vernoy, LMFT
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Estimated from 12 chart positions in 12 markets.
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- 🇺🇸US · Alternative Health#1205K to 30K
- 🇰🇷KR · Alternative Health#8810K to 30K
- 🇮🇳IN · Alternative Health#1471K to 10K
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11K to 41K🎙 Daily cadence·483 episodes·Last published 2d ago - Monthly Reach
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35K to 138K🇺🇸22%🇰🇷22%🇨🇿22%+9 more - Active Followers
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14K to 55K
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On the show
From 18 epsHosts
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Recent episodes
Should Conversion Therapy Be Protected Speech? What Chiles v. Salazar Means for Conversion Therapy Bans and the Future of the Profession
Jun 22, 2026
41m 42s
Good Enough, Safe Enough: Affirming LGBTQ+ Clients When You're Not a Specialist
Jun 15, 2026
40m 04s
Allyship Is Awkward: How Therapists Can Keep Showing Up Anyway
Jun 8, 2026
45m 13s
The Seven Stages of Queer Love: Therapy with Queer Couples, Queer Sex, and the Developmental Model - An Interview with Tom Bruett, LMFT
Jun 1, 2026
41m 00s
Modern Therapist's Consumer Guide: Paubox. HIPAA Compliant Email, Secure Communication, and Practice Privacy. An Interview with Hoala Greevy, Founder and CEO of Paubox
May 28, 2026
42m 30s
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| Date | Episode | Topics | Guests | Brands | Places | Keywords | Sponsor | Length | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 6/22/26 | ![]() Should Conversion Therapy Be Protected Speech? What Chiles v. Salazar Means for Conversion Therapy Bans and the Future of the Profession | Should Conversion Therapy Be Protected Speech? What Chiles v. Salazar Means for Conversion Therapy Bans and the Future of the Profession In Chiles v. Salazar, the Supreme Court ruled 8 to 1 that a therapist's talk therapy is protected speech, putting state conversion therapy bans at risk. Curt Widhalm, LMFT, and Katie Vernoy, LMFT break down what the March 31, 2026 decision actually says, what it does not say, and what it means for therapists who work with LGBTQ+ clients. The Court did not call conversion therapy safe, effective, or ethical, and it did not make the practice mandatory. It treated talk therapy as speech rather than regulable conduct, and sent Colorado's ban back to the lower courts for stricter First Amendment review. Curt and Katie walk through the strict scrutiny test at the center of the case, the Kagan and Sotomayor concurrence, and Justice Jackson's dissent, then sit with the harder question: what happens to the profession when the state can no longer set a guardrail on harmful practice before harm has occurred. Released during Pride Month, this is a candid, values-forward conversation about protecting LGBTQ+ clients and practicing affirming, anti-conversion-therapy care out loud. In this episode, we discuss: - What the Chiles v. Salazar ruling does, and does not, change about conversion therapy bans - Why the Court treated talk therapy as protected speech instead of medical treatment - How the strict scrutiny test decided the case - Where the concurrence and the dissent point the profession next - Concrete ways to signal affirming, anti-conversion-therapy care in your practice Full show notes and resources: mtsgpodcast.com Join the Modern Therapist Community Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined Modern Therapist's Survival Guide Creative Credits Voice Over by DW McCann: https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano: https://groomsymusic.com/ | 41m 42s | ||||||
| 6/15/26 | ![]() Good Enough, Safe Enough: Affirming LGBTQ+ Clients When You're Not a Specialist | Good Enough, Safe Enough: Affirming LGBTQ+ Clients When You're Not a Specialist Affirming LGBTQ+ clients when you are not a specialist: Curt Widhalm, LMFT, and Katie Vernoy, LMFT on being a good enough, safe enough therapist when you cannot refer out. Curt and Katie take on a question therapists often avoid: what do you do when an LGBTQ+ client needs care, you are not a specialist, and referring out is not possible, not safe, or not honest? In this Pride Month episode, they make the case that you can be a good enough, safe enough therapist for LGBTQ+ clients even when affirming care is not your declared specialty. Mental health deserts, narrow insurance panels, long specialist wait lists, and unsafe home environments mean referral is not always available, and sometimes referring out is closer to abandonment than care. Curt and Katie argue that scope of competence is too often used as polite cover for therapist discomfort, and that most clinical work with LGBTQ+ clients is the same work you already do well. Affirming care is the container, not a separate specialty. They also get practical about being a safe enough stopgap therapist: building a just in time consultation kit, doing the cultural humility work, and reckoning with the invisible labor and consultation tax of allyship, including why you should never bill a client to research their own identity. And they name the specific moments when referring an LGBTQ+ client out is still the right and ethical call. This is a useful conversation for generalist therapists, rural and solo clinicians, insurance-based practices, and anyone doing the ongoing work of affirming, culturally humble care. In this episode, we discuss: - Why "refer out" can be avoidance dressed as ethics, and when it is genuinely the right call - How to tell a true scope of competence limit from your own discomfort - What it means to be a good enough, safe enough therapist for LGBTQ+ clients - How to build a just in time kit so an LGBTQ+ client never lands on you cold - Why the invisible labor and consultation tax of allyship is yours to carry, not your client's to fund - The specific signs that mean you should refer out anyway Timestamps: 00:15 - Why a Pride Month episode on being good enough, not a specialist 02:56 - "Just refer out": sound advice or avoidance? 05:05 - Scope of competence versus therapist discomfort 13:08 - The good enough therapist, and when referral becomes abandonment 16:55 - Meeting clients where they are until specialist care opens up 19:03 - Building a just in time kit for your practice 24:44 - The invisible labor and consultation tax of allyship 32:10 - When you should refer out anyway Full show notes and transcript: mtsgpodcast.com Join the Modern Therapist Community Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined Modern Therapist's Survival Guide Creative Credits Voice Over by DW McCann: https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano: https://groomsymusic.com/ | 40m 04s | ||||||
| 6/8/26 | ![]() Allyship Is Awkward: How Therapists Can Keep Showing Up Anyway✨ | allyshipcultural humility+5 | — | Anti-Racism School Is In SessionMind Ya Mental | — | allyshiptherapists+5 | — | 45m 13s | |
| 6/1/26 | ![]() The Seven Stages of Queer Love: Therapy with Queer Couples, Queer Sex, and the Developmental Model - An Interview with Tom Bruett, LMFT✨ | queer couples therapyqueer relationship development+3 | Tom Bruett | Queer Relationship InstituteThe Go-To Relationship Guide for Gay Men: From Honeymoon to Lasting Commitment | — | queer lovecouples therapy+3 | — | 41m 00s | |
| 5/28/26 | ![]() Modern Therapist's Consumer Guide: Paubox. HIPAA Compliant Email, Secure Communication, and Practice Privacy. An Interview with Hoala Greevy, Founder and CEO of Paubox✨ | HIPAA compliancesecure communication+4 | Hoala Greevy | PauboxGoogle Workspace+4 | — | HIPAA compliant emailsecure email delivery+6 | — | 42m 30s | |
| 5/25/26 | ![]() Before You Refer to the Hospital: De-Escalation, Safety Planning, and Wraparound Care for Teens in Crisis✨ | de-escalationsafety planning+4 | Katie Vernoy | DBT private practicecommunity mental health | — | suicidal teenscrisis intervention+3 | — | 1h 13m 19s | |
| 5/18/26 | ![]() Inside the Troubled Teen Industry: Wilderness Therapy, Residential Treatment, and the Harm Done to Kids – An Interview with Chelsea Maldonado and Dr. Will Dobud✨ | troubled teen industrywilderness therapy+3 | Chelsea MaldonadoDr. Will Dobud | Atlantis Leadership Academy | — | troubled teenswilderness therapy+6 | — | 49m 19s | |
| 5/11/26 | ![]() Why Therapists Stop Working with Kids and What It Takes to Stay: Sustainability, Boundaries, and Pivots for the Long Haul✨ | therapists working with kidssustainability in therapy+3 | — | — | — | child therapyteen therapy+5 | — | 42m 47s | |
| 5/7/26 | ![]() When Good Moms Feel Bad: Supporting Mothers in Therapy with IFS and the Mom Parts Method – An Interview with Jessica Tomich Sorci, LMFT✨ | maternal mental healthInternal Family Systems+4 | Jessica Tomich Sorci | BalanceWhen Good Moms Feel Bad: An Empowering Guide for Transforming Guilt, Anxiety and Anger into Compassion, Confidence and Connectedness | — | maternal mental healthIFS+7 | — | 44m 27s | |
| 5/4/26 | ![]() Why Fixing Teens Doesn’t Work and What Actually Helps Youth Mental Health: An Interview with Dr. Will Dobud✨ | youth mental healthadolescent behavior+4 | Dr. Will Dobud | Charles Sturt University | — | youth therapyadolescents+7 | — | 47m 23s | |
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| 4/27/26 | ![]() The Burden of Potential: Therapy for Gifted Adults Navigating Burnout, Identity, and 2e Considerations✨ | gifted adultsburnout+4 | — | Modern Therapist Learning Communitymoderntherapistcommunity.com | — | giftednessburnout+5 | — | 1h 15m 06s | |
| 4/23/26 | ![]() How Therapists Can Help Clients With IBS, Chronic Nausea, and Gut-Brain Disorders: An Interview with Dr. Ali Navidi✨ | gut-brain interactionIBS+4 | Dr. Ali Navidi | GI PsychologyAmerican College of Gastroenterology+4 | — | IBSchronic nausea+7 | — | 40m 17s | |
| 4/20/26 | ![]() What Therapists Need to Know About Neurodivergent Clients and Families: An Interview with David Smith, LCSW✨ | neurodiversity-affirming therapyautism+5 | David Smith | LCSWOregon+4 | — | neurodiversitytherapy+6 | — | 50m 39s | |
| 4/16/26 | ![]() How Clients Experience Therapy: From First Inquiry to the Waiting Room: An Interview with Michael Ashford✨ | client experiencetherapy process+5 | Michael Ashford | Sign In SolutionsKansas State University | — | therapyclient experience+6 | — | 44m 38s | |
| 4/13/26 | ![]() Adapting EMDR for Neurodivergent Clients: Parts Work, Attunement, and Affirming Trauma Therapy, An Interview with Cathy Hanville and Christine MacInnis✨ | EMDR adaptationneurodivergent clients+4 | Cathy HanvilleChristine MacInnis | Transcends Family Therapy | — | EMDRneurodiversity+6 | — | 42m 23s | |
| 4/6/26 | ![]() When Clients Reject Your Diagnosis: How to Handle Pushback Without Losing the Therapeutic Alliance✨ | client diagnosistherapeutic alliance+5 | — | — | — | diagnosisclient resistance+5 | — | 42m 00s | |
| 4/1/26 | ![]() The Lasting Harm of Conversion Therapy: An Interview with Samuel Nieves✨ | conversion therapymental health+3 | Samuel Nieves | Conversion Therapy Survivor Network | — | conversion therapySOGIECE+3 | — | 39m 42s | |
| 3/30/26 | ![]() The Private Practice Pivot: How Therapists Are Adapting to Platforms, Agency Work, and the Changing Therapy Economy✨ | private practicetherapy platforms+3 | — | HeadwayAlma+1 | — | therapyprivate practice+5 | — | 36m 48s | |
| 3/23/26 | ![]() Is Independent Private Practice Sustainable? Data on Caseloads, Insurance & Income – An Interview with Lindsay Oberleitner, PhD✨ | independent private practicecaseload trends+3 | Lindsay Oberleitner | SimplePractice | — | private practicemental health+5 | — | 49m 37s | |
| 3/16/26 | ![]() Why You’re Exhausted in Private Practice: The Hidden Work Behind the Client Hour✨ | private practiceburnout+3 | — | The Modern Therapist's Survival Guide | — | private practiceclient hours+5 | — | 42m 15s | |
| 3/9/26 | ![]() Burnout Recovery in a Failing System: ACT, Moral Injury & Reclaiming Agency – An Interview with Shaina Siber, LCSW | Burnout Recovery in a Failing System – An Interview with Shaina Siber, LCSW Therapists are navigating hiring freezes, wage stagnation, insurance instability, identity-level threats, and mounting systemic uncertainty — all while supporting clients experiencing the same instability. What happens when burnout isn’t just about workload, but about working inside a system that feels like it’s failing? Curt and Katie talk with Shaina Siber, LCSW, about moral injury, burnout as a fawning trauma response, and how therapists can move from control strategies to agency using Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT) and Compassion-Focused Therapy (CFT). Shaina shares how psychological flexibility, compassionate prioritization, and values-based action can help therapists recover from burnout without abandoning their humanity. In this episode, we discuss: • Burnout as a trauma response • Moral injury in modern mental health care • The “K-shaped” labor market and therapist stagnation • Moving from overcontrol to agency • Sustainable contribution without collapsing Guest Bio: Shaina Siber, LCSW is the founder of Affirm Mental Health, host of The Affirming Minds Podcast, and author of the forthcoming Routledge book Using ACT and CFT for Burnout Recovery: The Beyond Burnout Blueprint (available for pre-order February 25, 2026). She brings over 15 years of clinical and leadership experience and specializes in trauma-informed, LGBTQ+, and culturally responsive care. Full show notes and resources: mtsgpodcast.com Join our community: Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined Linktree: https://linktr.ee/therapyreimagined Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide Creative Credits: Voice Over by DW McCann – https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano – https://groomsymusic.com/ | 40m 57s | ||||||
| 3/6/26 | ![]() Should Texas Therapists Stop Treating Kids? Texas SB14, Gender-Affirming Care, and the Risks for Therapists | Should Texas Therapists Stop Treating Kids? Texas SB14, Gender-Affirming Care, and the Risks for Therapists In this episode of the Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy discuss a new interpretation of Texas SB14 that may place therapists at risk for providing gender-affirming care to trans youth. They explore how a recent opinion from the Texas Attorney General could broaden the law’s reach beyond medical providers to include mental health professionals. Curt and Katie break down what this interpretation could mean for therapists working with minors, including possible risks related to licensure, malpractice coverage, mandated reporting, and criminal liability. They also discuss the ethical tension between evidence-based care and compliance with state law, and the difficult decisions clinicians may face when considering whether to continue working with kids. Key Takeaways: A new interpretation of Texas SB14 may include mental health professionals as part of the “healthcare pipeline” facilitating gender transition for minors. The legal term “facilitating” could potentially include referrals, letters, or even supportive therapy conversations. Therapists may face risks related to licensure complaints, malpractice coverage exclusions, or legal consequences if their care is interpreted as supporting gender transition. Mandated child abuse reporting requirements could create additional legal and ethical concerns. Clinicians may need to assess their personal risk tolerance when deciding whether to continue working with minors. Full show notes and additional resources will be available at:mtsgpodcast.com Join our community: Modern Therapists Group (Facebook): https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimaginedLink Tree: https://linktr.ee/therapyreimagined Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide Creative Credits Voice Over by DW McCannhttps://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Manganohttps://groomsymusic.com/ | 40m 56s | ||||||
| 3/2/26 | ![]() The Licensing Racket: Therapist Licensing, Discipline, and Access to Care – An Interview with Rebecca Haw Allensworth | The Licensing Racket: Therapist Licensing, Discipline, and Access to Care – An Interview with Rebecca Haw Allensworth Who does licensing protect - the public or the profession? Curt and Katie talk with Rebecca Haw Allensworth, law professor and author of The Licensing Racket, about how professional licensing boards actually function, and what that means for therapists, discipline, and access to care. After attending licensing board meetings across professions and states, Rebecca identified a troubling pattern: entry requirements that continually “ratchet up,” while discipline decisions can lean toward giving professionals the benefit of the doubt. The result? Higher barriers to entry, workforce shortages, and inconsistent public protection. This episode explores therapist licensing reform, self-regulation, professional turf wars, board funding structures, and the tension between prestige, professional identity, and public safety. About Our Guest:Rebecca Haw Allensworth is the David Daniels Allen Professor of Law at Vanderbilt Law School and author of The Licensing Racket: How We Decide Who Is Allowed to Work and Why It Goes Wrong. Her research focuses on antitrust and professional licensing and has been cited by the U.S. Supreme Court. Key Takeaways: • Why licensing requirements tend to increase over time • How self-regulation can create blind spots in discipline • The impact of licensing barriers on workforce shortages and access to care • Why complaints about unlicensed practice may be prioritized over client complaints • How professional identity and funding structures shape board decisions Full show notes and resources: mtsgpodcast.com Join our community: Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide Creative Credits: Voice Over by DW McCann https://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Mangano https://groomsymusic.com/ | 48m 58s | ||||||
| 2/23/26 | ![]() Training Therapists in the Age of AI: Preventing Deskilling and Teaching Clinical Judgment | Training Therapists in the Age of AI: Preventing Deskilling and Teaching Clinical Judgment As artificial intelligence becomes increasingly embedded in mental health care, therapists, supervisors, and educators face a critical responsibility: integrating AI tools without eroding clinical judgment, reasoning, and skill development. In this continuing education episode of the Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy examine how AI can create the illusion of competence while quietly undermining the processes therapists rely on to learn how to think clinically. They explore therapist deskilling as a systemic issue shaped by training models, supervision practices, and productivity pressures rather than individual failure. This episode focuses on how supervisors, educators, and clinicians can preserve clinical mastery while using AI responsibly, emphasizing learning science, supervision ethics, and the importance of maintaining human judgment in an automated world. In this episode, we discuss: How AI can mask gaps in clinical reasoning The competence paradox and automation bias in therapy Why struggle and ambiguity are essential for learning The role of supervisors and educators in preventing deskilling How to use AI without outsourcing clinical judgment Continuing Education: This episode is eligible for 1 unit of continuing education (CE). To earn CE credit, go to moderntherapistcommunity.com, register for a free profile, purchase the course, complete the post-test and evaluation, and download your certificate. Full show notes, transcript, and course details are available at mtsgpodcast.com. Join the Modern Therapist Community: Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimagined Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast Podcast Home: https://mtsgpodcast.com Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide Creative Credits: Voice Over by DW McCannhttps://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Manganohttps://groomsymusic.com/ | 1h 13m 38s | ||||||
| 2/16/26 | ![]() Why Food Anxiety Is Not Always About Dieting: Understanding ARFID and Intuitive Eating An interview with Robyn L. Goldberg, RDN, CEDS-C | Why Food Anxiety Is Not Always About Dieting: Understanding ARFID and Intuitive Eating - An interview with Robyn L. Goldberg, RDN, CEDS-C Diet culture often dominates conversations about eating disorders, but not all struggles with food are driven by weight, body image, or dieting. In this episode, Curt Widhalm and Katie Vernoy talk with registered dietitian nutritionist and certified eating disorder specialist Robyn L. Goldberg about Avoidant Restrictive Food Intake Disorder (ARFID), intuitive eating, and how therapists can recognize when food anxiety requires a different clinical approach. Robyn explains how ARFID differs from more familiar eating disorders, why it is often mislabeled as “picky eating,” and when intuitive eating principles need to be adapted or set aside. This conversation offers therapists practical guidance for assessment, referral, and collaboration with eating-disorder-informed dietitians. Key Takeaways ARFID is not driven by weight or body image concerns and is often rooted in sensory sensitivities, trauma, or fear of aversive consequences Intuitive eating is not a one-size-fits-all model and may require significant structure for some clients Rigid food rules and avoidance can be protective for clients but may also limit functioning and quality of life Exposure-based approaches are often central to ARFID treatment and require specialized training Therapists should refer to eating-disorder-informed dietitians when food restriction significantly impacts health or daily life Guest Bio Robyn L. Goldberg, RDN, CEDS-C, is a registered dietitian nutritionist and certified eating disorder dietitian and consultant with over twenty-eight years of experience. She is the author of The Eating Disorder Trap, host of The Eating Disorder Trap Podcast, and a nationally recognized expert featured in major media outlets. Full Show NotesRead the full show notes and resources at: https://www.mtsgpodcast.com Community and SupportJoin our Facebook group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/therapyreimaginedSupport the podcast on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/mtsgpodcast Modern Therapist’s Survival Guide Creative Credits Voiceover by DW McCannhttps://www.facebook.com/McCannDW/ Music by Crystal Grooms Manganohttps://groomsymusic.com/ | 37m 47s | ||||||
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Chart Positions
12 placements across 12 markets.
Chart Positions
12 placements across 12 markets.

























