The Underground

Recorded live at Glee 2025, this episode brings two very different lenses on garden retail performance and growth. First, Amy and Libby Stubbs share how British Garden Centres has scaled to 73 locations while keeping each site’s individuality, from centre-level social media to data-driven benchmarking and a renewed focus on tech, process and customer loyalty. Then Reverend Dave Walker explains how he’s reviving Sheffield’s Birley Moor Garden Centre with community at the core: forest school education, nature-based improvements on site and a clear-eyed approach to cash flow, planning and supplier partnerships.In this episode you’ll hear: Leadership and next-gen talent: Amy’s step up to Managing Director, the sisters’ complementary strengths, and how giving younger leaders real responsibility builds momentum.Destination thinking, not just tills: Events, evening opportunities and “point of difference” from suppliers that help educate newer gardeners.An independent’s turnaround playbook: Why Rev Dave bought his childhood garden centre, drove a 43% turnover uplift in year one, and grew the team from 4 to 28, before even opening the café.Community as a growth lever: Forest school provision, Help for Heroes meet-ups and on-site biodiversity plans including a wetland to deliver Biodiversity Net Gain and mitigate local flooding risks.Planning in the real world: Lessons from a 15-month Green Belt change-of-use process, and why popular street-food outlet Grandpa Joe’s remains part of the future mix.Supplier takeaways: What will make buyers at large groups stop at your stand at Glee, and what independents need from suppliers right now, from extended terms to stronger POS and marketing support.Who should listen:Garden centre owners and managers, heads of retail and catering, supplier teams planning 2026 ranges, and anyone interested in loyalty, operational efficiency and community-led footfall growth.British Garden Centres: http://britishgardencentres.com Birley Moor Garden Centre: http://birleymoor.co.uk/ Sussex Seed Balls: https://www.sussexseedballs.com

Evergreen Garden Care’s UK & Ireland Marketing Director, Karen Wilkinson, joins Phil and Kate to unpack Evergreen’s new five-year category vision, how better education can unlock growth, and what it really takes to build a brand that earns shopper trust. Expect practical takeaways for suppliers and retailers ahead of Glee.Inside Evergreen’s category visionKaren explains how the team stepped back after a tough season to map long-term category growth, identifying over £152m of incremental upside if the industry attracts new shoppers and helps existing gardeners do more, spend smarter, and trade up where value is clear.The 5 category drivers at a glance:Your Journey Begins: win new gardeners at key life stages, for example moving home, getting a pet, having children or retiring. Even a 1–2% increase in gardeners could add £40m+ over five years. Next Project Inspiration: nudge current gardeners to try something new each year, from veg trugs to greenhouse growing, with smart brand partnerships and complete solutions. £30m+ potential. Love Your Lawn: guide people through the season, from spring treatments to summer feed and seed, encouraging one more trip and one more product. £20m over five years. Worth Paying More For: make trade-up simple by clearly explaining performance differences and reasons to believe across good, better, best. Urban Oasis: serve renters and small-space gardeners with right-sized packs, accessible advice and small-space projects, building tomorrow’s gardeners today. £15m potential. Be consumer-first: listen for real needs and where audiences actually spend time.Build trust: especially if you play at a premium. Proof beats promises.Make it easy: simplify choices, claims and navigation at shelf and online.Education that actually helps“Meet people where they are.” Karen outlines a sector-wide need for clear, confidence-building education across POS, packs, online and social, from YouTube and TikTok to house-and-home media. The aim is accessible, encouraging guidance that reduces overwhelm and grows category participation.Trust and qualityEvergreen is now fully peat-free and has invested heavily in operations and large-scale market trials with garden centres to prove real-world performance. For 2025, Miracle-Gro is putting a front-of-pack quality guarantee and a team of horticulture-trained “garden gurus” behind its plant foods and growing media to reassure shoppers and strengthen the category.Brand-building playbookFor challengers: know your audience, be distinctive, and lean into the emotion of gardening, not just the functional.Glee previewOn stand: a warm welcome, strong coffee, new Miracle-Gro campaigns and redesigned packs with clearer claims and back-of-pack guidance, plus a hands-on “potting shed” to showcase peat-free quality.Why listenIf you’re a supplier, brand or garden centre team, this episode gives you a practical lens for growth, a blueprint for education that converts, and brand-building principles you can apply immediately, whether you’re Miracle-Gro or a new challenger.

In this episode of The Underground Podcast, Phil and Kate sit down with Nikki Burton, Managing Director, and Dr Victoria Wright, Technical Manager at Melcourt, the UK’s leading peat-free growing media company.Melcourt has been at the forefront of sustainable horticulture for over 40 years, building its reputation on bark-based innovation, technical excellence, and consistent quality, epitomised by their RHS endorsement. Nikki and Victoria share the company’s journey from forestry roots to Royal Warrant holders, with insights into how they pioneered their peat-free products long before it became a national priority.Listeners will discover:Why Melcourt has always been peat free and how its SylvaGrow range has become a benchmark for both professionals and home gardeners.The challenges of consumer education in a market where “peat free” often tells you what a product isn’t, rather than what it is.How consistency, raw ingredient knowledge, and supply chain expertise are critical to building trust in growing media.The importance of industry collaboration, from DEFRA to the Responsible Sourcing Scheme.Future opportunities and the role legislation, standards, and education will play in accelerating the industry-wide transition.Packed with practical insights for garden centre teams, retail buyers, and brand marketers, this episode sheds light on one of the most debated issues in horticulture and highlights how Melcourt is helping shape the future of sustainable growing.http://melcourt.co.uk/Your hosts:Phil Wright: ⁠⁠http://wrightobara.com⁠⁠Kate Turner: ⁠⁠http://www.gardenerguru.co.uk

In this episode of The Underground Podcast, Phil and Kate welcome Anna Wili, Head of Marketing for the National Garden Scheme (NGS), a charity with almost a century of history opening gardens for good causes. Anna shares how the NGS began in 1927 as a way to fund district nursing, and how it’s grown to over 3,500 gardens opening each year, raising more than £74 million for nursing and health charities.We explore the unique blend of horticulture, hospitality, and heart that makes garden visiting so special. From peeping behind rarely opened gates to enjoying a slice of homemade cake. Anna reveals how the NGS champions the link between gardens and wellbeing, the variety of gardens that take part (from manicured estates to wildlife havens), and the personal stories that bring each opening to life.With the charity’s centenary celebrations in 2027 on the horizon, Anna also outlines exciting plans for brand partnerships with the garden industry, opportunities for garden centres and suppliers, and how professionals across the sector can get involved.Whether you’re a garden centre owner, a manufacturer, or simply a passionate gardener, this episode is packed with insights into:How the NGS sustains a 100-year tradition of generosity and community spiritThe role of gardens in health, biodiversity, and wellbeingOpportunities for collaboration and brand licensing in the run-up to the centenaryHow to become an NGS garden owner and why you shouldn’t be shy about your patchAnd of course, we discover which celebrity Anna would most like to see open their garden for charity…Listen in and be inspired to throw open your own garden gates or work with the NGS to help them grow their impact even further.National Garden Scheme: https://ngs.org.uk/Your hosts:Phil Wright: ⁠⁠http://wrightobara.com⁠⁠Kate Turner: ⁠⁠http://www.gardenerguru.co.uk

In this episode of The Underground Podcast, Phil is joined by Beth Johnson, CEO of Umbrella, the promotions agency behind major campaigns for brands like Cadbury and Unilever. Together, they explore how the garden sector can borrow from the grocery playbook to drive footfall, shift stock, and boost brand engagement.Beth shares:Why promotions are about more than discounts—and how they can build brand equityReal-world examples from FMCG, including VIP merch drops, cashback offers, and sports tie-insHow garden retailers could better use loyalty schemes and customer dataWhy personalisation is the future—and how brands should preparePractical advice for running legally sound, high-impact promotions in physical and digital spacesWhether you're a brand manager, garden centre buyer, or just curious about how to turn browsers into buyers, this episode is packed with insights on how promotions, done right, can spark growth.Relevant for: garden brands, garden centres, product marketers, FMCG professionals, and anyone curious about shopper behaviour and brand-building.For more on Beth's work: team-umbrella.co.uk

In this episode, Kate and Phil sit down with Beth Anderson, a passionate plant health inspector and dedicated advocate for Young People in Horticulture. Beth shares her journey through the YPHA’s pilot Launch Success Challenge, a year-long initiative designed to equip under-35s with real-world marketing and branding skills for the horticultural industry.From giving the humble Begonia an image makeover to pitching to industry leaders, and masterminding giant crepe paper flowers for Gardeners World Live, Beth talks candidly about teamwork, creativity, and why she believes the warmth and openness of horticulture makes it a truly unique place to build a career. Expect plenty of laughs, behind-the-scenes stories, and a dose of infectious enthusiasm that might just make you see begonias (and compost!) in a whole new light.YPHA: https://www.ypha.org.uk/Your hosts:Phil Wright: ⁠⁠http://wrightobara.com⁠⁠Kate Turner: ⁠⁠http://www.gardenerguru.co.uk

In this first episode of a two-part special from The Underground Podcast, hosts Kate and Phil dig into the root of the industry’s biggest environmental pivot—going peat free. With decades of dependency on this “gold standard” of growing media, why is it now so crucial to leave peat behind? And why is it proving so hard to replace?From the carbon cost of extraction to the slow regeneration of peatlands, this episode explores the environmental urgency driving the move away from peat. But this is no simple switch. Through conversations with leading scientists, manufacturers, campaigners, and trade leaders, we uncover what made peat so effective—and why sustainable alternatives must work harder to match its performance.Whether you’re a professional grower, a home gardener, or simply peat-curious, this episode lays the groundwork for understanding what’s at stake and what’s next in this growing media revolution. Episode 2 will pick up the trail, delving into the practical realities of making peat-free work.Featuring:Elaine Gotts – Research & Development Scientist, Levington / Evergreen Garden CareSimon Blackhurst – Horticulture ConsultantWill Scott – Team Leader, Heart of Eden (AHS Limited)Jane Hartley – Brand Portfolio Manager, Evergreen Garden CareSteve Harper – Chair, Responsible Sourcing Scheme & Managing Director, Southern TridentSally Nex – Environmental Gardener & Campaigner, Peat-Free PartnershipFran Barnes – Chief Executive, Horticultural Trades AssociationJane Lawler – Marketing Consultant & HTA Board MemberDan Durston – National Sales Director, Durston’sToby Thomas – Managing Director, RocketGro

In this episode of The Underground Podcast, Phil and Kate sit down with internationally acclaimed garden designer, TV presenter, and horticulturalist Peter Donegan. Known for his visionary approach to garden design, Peter shares his journey from growing plants under his bed as a child to designing breathtaking landscapes around the world. His passion for storytelling through gardens shines through as he discusses transformative projects, including a poignant garden in Melbourne honouring veterans and a hidden courtyard garden in a 13th-century French castle (links to view below)Peter also delves into the importance of biodiversity, how small urban gardens can make a big impact, and why gardens should evoke emotion rather than just tick design boxes. With his signature blend of insight, humour, and deep expertise, Peter offers a fresh perspective on what it really means to create meaningful green spaces.Don't miss Peter Donegan as he presents the APL (Association of Professional Landscapers) Awards on Friday 14th March at The Brewery, London.Tune in for an inspiring episode filled with passion, creativity, and a little bit of rock and roll in garden design!Peter Donegan: https://doneganlandscaping.comMelbourne Garden: https://doneganlandscaping.com/blog/2024/03/24/peoples-choice-award-melbourne-international-flower-and-garden-show-2024/French Garden: https://doneganlandscaping.com/blog/2022/06/28/inauguration-chateau-de-peronne-jardin-philophrosyne/Laburnocytisus 'Adamii': https://www.suttons.co.uk/laburnocytisus-adamii_MH12152Your hosts:Phil Wright: ⁠⁠http://wrightobara.com⁠⁠Kate Turner: ⁠⁠http://www.gardenerguru.co.uk