Typology

Every once in a while, a conversation comes along that makes you pull out your earbuds and stare into the middle distance. This is one of those. My guest today didn't come to promote a book or launch a course. He's here because he's a good friend with hard-won wisdom — and the rare ability to articulate what's actually going on inside. Meet Brian Boecker, therapist at Restoring the Soul in Denver, Colorado, and an Enneagram Nine who has spent years doing the slow, unglamorous, profoundly important work of finding himself. We go deep on what it really means to belong versus simply fit in, why desire is so terrifying to name out loud, and how anger — when you stop running from it — turns out to be something closer to a life force than a liability. Brian is disarmingly honest about the ways he's learned to disappear, the slow work of becoming solid, and what it looks like to finally walk through the door you've been standing in front of your whole life. Whether you're a Nine or you love one, this conversation will give you a richer, more compassionate picture of what's actually going on beneath that calm surface.

In this episode of Typology, I sit down with therapist and author Joe Nucci for a thoughtful, wide-ranging conversation about the Enneagram, mental health, and the growing misuse of therapeutic language in our culture. Joe—an Enneagram Three—shares his own journey with the Enneagram, the hidden shame dynamics of Threes, and how public success can quietly pull us toward performance instead of integrity. Together, we explore why tools like the Enneagram work best as maps, not MRIs—helpful for self-awareness and empathy, but dangerous when they turn into rigid labels. We also dig into Joe's new book, Psycho Babble, discussing how clinical terms like narcissist, OCD, and trauma have become everyday adjectives—and what it costs us when labels replace discernment, curiosity, and real relationship. This is a grounded, honest conversation about growth, character, and what it actually means to become a healthier version of yourself—without turning self-awareness into self-avoidance. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ABOUT JOE NUCCI Joe Nucci is an expert in breaking down how people talk about mental health. He's a psychotherapist who corrects widely misused terms, adds valuable nuance and explains complex ideas in ways anyone can understand. He can take a mental health lens to any hot button issue. Anyone who listens to him will walk away knowing themselves and others a little better. Joe reached over 10 million people in his first 6 months of posting content. His book "Psychobabble" explores why mental health information is so confusing to navigate and how to more easily understand different perspectives about mental health. He also has an upcoming podcast, being produced by Luminary Podcasts, where he will take deeper dives into the different mental health topics that he explores on Instagram, Facebook and Tiktok @joenuccitherapy Pscyhobabble: Viral Mental Health Myths & the Truths to Set You Free

What happens when the worst thing you've been afraid of actually happens—and you're still standing? In this episode of Typology, I sit down with songwriter Brad Warren—an Enneagram Six, a man in long-term recovery, a husband, a father, and someone who has walked straight through unimaginable grief and come out the other side with humility, humor, and hard-won wisdom. Brad is the kind of person who tells the truth without posturing, who can laugh at himself without diminishing himself, and who understands—deeply—that fear doesn't disappear just because you name it. But naming it does change the game. We talk about the Enneagram Six's instinct to scan the horizon for danger, to rehearse conversations that never happen, and to catastrophize not because they're weak—but because they care. A lot. Brad shares how losing a child forced him to face his worst fears head-on, and how recovery, faith, and accountability helped him learn the difference between imagined catastrophe and lived reality. There's a kind of quiet courage in the way he describes trusting God—not a God who's looking to smite him, but one who's patiently inviting him to rest. Along the way, we explore humor as both a survival strategy and a spiritual practice, the surprising connection between humility and laughter, and how Sixes learn to move from fear-driven vigilance to faith-filled presence. We also touch on marriage, loyalty, religious deconstruction with gratitude instead of bitterness, and the life-saving power of people who are willing to tell you the truth when your mind is lying to you. This episode is funny, tender, honest, and deeply human. It's about fear—but it's even more about trust. And what it looks like, day by day, to choose it anyway. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- About Brad Warren Brad Warren is a Nashville-based songwriter and artist best known as one half of the hitmaking Warren Brothers. He has co-written major country hits recorded by Tim McGraw, Toby Keith , Keith Urban, Faith Hill , Martina McBride, Dierks Bentley, Jason Aldean and more. Brad is also the host of the Good Grief Good God podcast. He and his wife Michelle lost their oldest son Sage in 2020 and the podcast is in honor of him. Brad covers an array of other topics (recovery, God, mental and physical health, and The Music Business) as well as grief. Guests have ranged from Sheryl Crow and Amy Grant to Scott Hamilton and Charles Esten.

What if your most meaningful work begins after you stop striving to prove yourself? In this warm, wide-ranging conversation, I sit down with old friend, songwriter, filmmaker, and Enneagram Two Andrew Greer for a heartful exploration of loneliness, love, boundaries, creativity, and what it really means to live a good life. Andrew opens up about the hidden sadness behind the Enneagram Two's gift for connection—the ache that often fuels the desire to help, anticipate, and care for others. Together, we unpack how pride, control, and fear of being a burden can quietly shape relationships, and how learning to receive may be the most courageous spiritual practice of all. We also dive into Andrew's new book, More Than a President, and explore Jimmy Carter as a quintessential Enneagram One—principled, disciplined, justice-driven, and far more impactful after the presidency than during it. This episode is a meditation on personality, vocation, and maturity—on shifting focus from résumé to soul, from achievement to love, from striving to rest. It's thoughtful, funny, deeply human, and quietly challenging. Pull up a chair. This one stays with you. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- About Andrew Greer Author, musician, and filmmaker, Andrew Greer has published three books, released multiple chart-topping recordings, and directed the PBS documentary Plainspoken, a film inspired by the lives of Jimmy and Rosalynn Carter and their neighbors in Plains, Georgia. A Texas native, and longtime Nashvillian, Greer now makes his home in Plains. Website: https://www.andrew-greer.com/ New Book: http://sundayswithjimmycarter.com/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andrewbgreer/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/agreermusic

With the holidays just around the corner, we're bringing back a conversation that continues to deliver relational gold. Whether you heard it the first time or you're discovering it now, this replay with author and Enneagram teacher Christina Wilcox offers a beautifully practical and deeply compassionate look at how the Enneagram can transform the way we show up for one another during the most emotionally charged season of the year. In this episode, Christina shares her journey of discovering herself as an Enneagram Six—along with the courage, clarity, and self-understanding that followed. Together, we explore how each type navigates holiday stress, joy, expectation, and connection…and how you can care for the people you love in ways that truly meet them where they are. You'll learn: How to support friends and family of every Enneagram type through the busyness and emotional intensity of the holidays Practical tools for managing social anxiety, especially for Sixes Why presence and gratitude matter so deeply, particularly for Fours—and how all of us can cultivate them Simple, insightful practices for building healthier, more attuned relationships this time of year Whether you're hoping to deepen your emotional intelligence, strengthen your closest relationships, or simply bring more kindness and awareness into your holiday rhythms, this episode is a gift worth unwrapping again. Lean in, listen well, and let the Enneagram help you love the people in your life a little better this Christmas. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ P.S. For a limited time, take 40% off all Enneagram Courses through the holidays. Use the discount code HOLIDAY40 here.

This week on Typology, we welcomed the incomparable Lynn Smith—former national news anchor turned communications strategist, executive coach, and proud (and newly discovered) Enneagram Three with a Two wing. And friends… buckle up. This conversation is a masterclass in emotional intelligence, presence, and what it means to pursue success without losing yourself in the chase. Fresh off taking the Typology Assessment, Lynn joined us in that familiar Three-ish blend of humor, candor, and high-octane energy, joking that the results made her want to immediately call her therapist. What unfolded from there was a remarkably vulnerable exploration of people-pleasing, approval-seeking, identity, and the hidden costs of a lifetime spent earning applause. Lynn pulled back the curtain on her years in broadcast news—an industry where worth is measured in seconds, headlines, and flawless delivery—and revealed the deeper story beneath her polished exterior: a lifelong drive to achieve, a tenderness inherited from her family's immigrant narrative, and a powerful desire to help others communicate with confidence and authenticity. But the real gem of this episode is Lynn's groundbreaking work on what she calls "the brain bully." That inner critic. That saboteur whispering that you're one misstep away from failure. That internal voice Threes know far too well. Lynn not only names it—she teaches you how to outsmart it. Her framework for dismantling fear and building resilient confidence is practical, empowering, and deeply human. And when she reveals her own brain bully's name—"Bob"—you can't help but laugh and exhale. Sometimes the most powerful breakthroughs come with a wink. We also wandered into a juicy conversation about magnetism versus authenticity, why your energy enters a room a full tenth of a second before you do, and how the Enneagram can radically improve communication across teams, industries, and families. Connect with Lynn Smith at www.lynnsmith.com or on socials at @lynnsmithtv CONNECT WITH IAN Learn more about the Enneagram at www.ianmorgancron.com or follow Ian at @ianmorgancron and @typologypodcast on Instagram and Facebook P.S. Interested in a 30-minute one-on-one virtual coaching session with Ian? Fill out our interest form here.

What happens when an Enneagram Two (or…maybe a Four?) takes a deep dive into the ache beneath our desire to be good, loved, and whole? This week, I sit down with Heath Hardesty, pastor and author of All Things Together: How Apprenticeship to Jesus Is the Way of Flourishing in a Fragmented World. What begins as a conversation about the Enneagram Two's longing to help soon unfurls into an exploration of the soul — the ache for beauty, the mystery of shame, and what it means to live authentically before God. Together we explore: The difference between helping and hiding Why our "ache" might actually be a form of divine homesickness How beauty, poetry, and the transcendent lead us toward wholeness What dies — and what's reborn — as we grow older and surrender our false selves The sacred invitation to move from doing ministry to stewarding mystery It's equal parts theology, therapy, and literary love letter. Whether you're a Two, a Four, or simply a human being trying to make sense of your inner world, this episode will remind you that becoming whole is less about striving and more about awakening. 🎙️ Listen now and discover the sacred ache that pulls us home. ABOUT HEATH HARDESTY Heath Hardesty is the author of All Things Together: How Apprenticeship to Jesus is the Way of Flourishing in a Fragmented World (Multnomah; 10/14/25). He serves as the lead pastor of Valley Community Church and is the founder of Inklings Coffee & Tea in the heart of downtown Pleasanton, California. Heath grew up in a blue-collar home and was a plumber's apprentice in Colorado before becoming a pastor on the edge of Silicon Valley where he, his wife, and four kids now reside. He holds degrees in literature, leadership, biblical studies, and theology from the University of Colorado Boulder and Western Seminary in Portland. Visit him on IG@heathhardesty.

What happens when two high-achieving Enneagram Threes sit down with an Enneagram Four? You get an electric, honest, and surprisingly tender conversation about ambition, fear, and what it really means to live courageously. In this episode, Ian sits down with Jenny Wood, former Google executive and author of Wild Courage: Go After What You Want and Get It, and her Chief of Staff, Carlina Daugherty, for an unfiltered look at the drive and depth behind the Enneagram Three. Together, they explore: · Why fear — not talent — is often the real barrier to success · The nine "wild" traits that fuel courageous leadership (and how to keep them from derailing you) · How two Threes with different subtypes actually make the perfect team · Jenny's raw reflections on control, comparison, and rediscovering what "enough" really means · The second half of life — and why it's less about achievement and more about awakening It's an episode packed with laughter, candor, and the kind of vulnerability that reminds us: success without self-awareness isn't success at all. 🎙️ Listen in and learn how to move from human doing to human being — with a dash of wild courage.