Zero Click Marketing

What if the best marketing doesn’t drive a click at all — but makes people seek you out?I chat with Jay Acunzo about why public speaking might be the ultimate form of zero click marketing, how to build ideas that actually matter to your audience, and why resonance beats reach when you’re trying to create work people remember.Jay breaks down how to build stronger arguments for your ideas, why commodity content has such a short shelf life, and what it really means to matter more instead of simply marketing more.Timestamps00:00 — Jay’s core idea: don’t market more, matter more02:26 — Why every talk needs to create a real shift, not just a to-do list04:24 — Jay’s “unsolicited response rate” metric06:00 — Reach vs. resonance, and why making people care is the actual job07:46 — Amanda’s coaching session with Jay and the missing “problem” in her talk08:47 — Why marketers need to slow down and develop ideas that matter14:21 — Creativity as trial and error, not instant genius17:22 — Asking questions Google can’t answer20:52 — Amanda’s favorite newsletter and useful zero-click content22:38 — Michelle Warner as an example of a zero-click business28:55 — How platforms reward lowest-common-denominator content30:16 — Why speaking gives you control that social platforms don’t34:48 — Jay’s podcast, *Why They Resonate*, and Amanda’s upcoming appearanceConnect with Jay Acunzo: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jayacunzo/Learn more about Jay Acunzo: https://jayacunzo.com/Sign up for Jay’s Newsletter: https://jayacunzo.com/newsletter Listen to Why They Resonate: https://open.spotify.com/show/2xMty2O4GBcG8F7ySudeXl Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Genius www.shareyourgenius.com

I chat with writer and strategist Kaleigh Moore about how content teams can adapt to AI search without sacrificing quality. Kaleigh shares her “source signal stack” framework, explains why third-party validation matters, and makes the case for treating LinkedIn, Reddit, YouTube, newsletters, and employee-led content as part of one larger visibility ecosystem.Timestamps00:00 — Why employee experts are such a powerful source of original content03:06 — How Kaleigh started learning AI tools and GEO/AEO hands-on05:46 — The “source signal stack” and how LLMs evaluate content09:40 — The messy reality of measuring AI visibility and attribution12:57 — Durable marketing bets in a fast-changing AI landscape17:09 — What effective employee advocacy can look like in practice20:43 — How internal talks can become LinkedIn, YouTube, and recruiting content26:07 — Kaleigh’s underrated tactic: syndicating newsletters on LinkedIn28:08 — Where to follow Kaleigh and read her newsletter, Context WindowConnect with Kaleigh Moore: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kaleighmoore/Learn more about Kaleigh Moore: https://www.kaleighmoore.com/Subscribe to Context Window: https://kaleigh-moore.kit.com/ Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com

The best-of-breed marketing stack made sense when traffic was cheap. But in a zero-click world, every lead is harder to earn — and every tool handoff is another place for that lead to die.In this episode, I make the case for rethinking bloated marketing stacks, explain why small teams may need fewer tools instead of "the best" tool for every job, and share how Typeform’s Growth Flow turns forms into richer workflows for capture, enrichment, automation, and reporting.Timestamps:00:00 — The best-of-breed era is ending01:00 — How we got from monoliths to unbundled SaaS stacks04:30 — What changed in a zero-click world07:00 — The hidden cost of handoffs11:00 — Typeform Growth Flow and built-in enrichment14:00 — The DTC skincare quiz funnel example18:00 — Five places a lead can die23:00 — The new question: “What’s the fewest tools I can run this through?”For the full DTC workflow, read my newsletter, "Your Marketing Stack Is About to Get Smaller."This episode is sponsored by Typeform. It features my honest take on Growth Flow.Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

AI search is changing SEO, but not because SEO is dead. It’s changing because search is becoming more zero-click.In this episode, I explain GEO — Generative Engine Optimization — and why it’s less about chasing AI hacks and more about making your content easier to retrieve, understand, cite, trust, and remember. I break down four practical mechanics of GEO: retrievability, extractability, credibility, and public evidence — and show why good AI visibility still starts with good marketing.Timestamps00:00 Why AI search is changing SEO01:35 What GEO actually means03:10 Why GEO is a zero-click marketing problem04:30 The four mechanics of GEO, beginning with retrievability08:30 Extractability: can your content be understood and reused?11:00 Credibility: why generic SEO content falls short13:30 Public evidence: why your brand’s off-site record matters18:45 Why GEO is not magic — it’s good marketingResources:Ahrefs study: AI Overviews Reduce Clicks by 58%Pre-order the Zero Click Marketing book (yes, there’s a chapter on AI marketing!)Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com

Marketers say they want good strategy. Then they optimize for whatever’s easiest to measure.This episode is about why easy-to-see metrics like traffic, likes, attributed pipeline, and rankings can create false confidence. Instead, better measurement can look like this: off-platform sharing, stronger sales conversations, customer education, adoption of your language, and content that does more than one job. In a zero-click world, the easiest metric to report is not always the one that matters most.Timestamps00:00 Why marketers optimize for what’s easiest to measure01:36 How SEO gets too much credit for capturing demand04:23 The Fitbit B2B example and content as a service06:09 Better ways to judge content quality07:54 Why the best content does more than one job11:12 What better measurement looks like in a zero-click worldYou can do audience research with all kinds of tools and networks like Google Trends, Exploding Topics, Reddit, and of course, my employer, SparkToro. You can create an always-free account and get 5 reports per month on sparktoro.com.Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com

Best practices can help you avoid obvious mistakes — but they can also make your marketing forgettable. In this episode, I explain why the real problem isn’t best practices themselves, but using them without personalization, taste, or audience insight. Drawing on my experience at Fitbit, I’ll show you how audience research leads to stronger content, smarter channel choices, and more compelling marketing — plus a few practical ways to get started without spending much money or time. This episode is an expansion of my blog post, “Best Practices Are Meaningless Without Audience Research.”Timestamps:00:00 How best practices turn into beige marketing01:27 The antidote: audience research02:01 The Fitbit example and the real B2B challenge03:43 Good marketers have always done some version of this05:08 More examples: marketers, skincare, and sports betting06:36 How to start doing audience research07:40 How to spot patterns faster09:38 Best practices only tell you the format10:05 How audience research improves taste11:02 Best practices get you on the field. Audience research helps you win.You can do audience research with all kinds of tools and networks like Google Trends, Exploding Topics, Reddit, and of course, my launch sponsor, SparkToro. You can create an always-free account and get 5 reports per month on sparktoro.com.Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com

A lot of marketers say they want better measurement. Usually, what they really want is cleaner attribution.In this episode, I argue that those are two different jobs. Attribution tends to reward the channel that captured demand once the buyer was already in motion. SparkToro's latest research proves that influence happens everywhere. So what we really need is better measurement — to help us understand lift: are more people searching for you, remembering you, mentioning you, and showing up ready to buy? If you confuse the two, you’ll keep overvaluing what’s easiest to credit and underestimating what actually drives demand.Timestamps:00:00 The real problem: buyers are influenced before the click01:41 Attribution vs. measurement: two different jobs04:33 Stop giving the wrong channels all the credit...05:10 ...because influence happens everywhere! 08:05 Why measurement needs to get broader and simpler09:30 Why we (accidentally?) end up starving our demand creation channels10:47 Measurement needs to grow up.11:24 Next week: influencing the public recordLearn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsThis episode was produced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com

A lot of marketers confuse polished with effective. Or they confuse consistency with substance. But neither one guarantees the work is actually good.In this episode, I make the case for a higher bar: usefulness. In a zero-click world, your content has to stand on its own. So before you worry about making it prettier or posting more often, ask whether the idea is actually strong enough to deserve attention.New here? Start with Episode 2: What Zero Click Marketing Actually IsJoin us next week — I’ll break down why marketers overvalue what’s easiest to count.Timestamps: 00:00 Intro 00:37 The tension between polish and volume 01:24 Why polish can signal care but not guarantee value 02:02 Why volume can create momentum but still say very little 02:38 The real bar: usefulness 03:15 Respecting your audience by assuming they’re smart 04:54 A simple test: strip away the design and ask whether the idea still holds up 05:20 What Amazon’s memo culture gets right 06:30 What to do when the idea itself is the problem 07:01 Three signs a piece of content is ready to publish 09:28 The hierarchy of useful marketing content 11:03 Why this matters even more in a zero-click world 11:46 The question to ask before you publish 12:15 Next week: why marketers overvalue what’s easiest to countLearn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | ThreadsProduced in partnership with Share Your Geniuswww.shareyourgenius.com

Once you understand the concept of Zero Click Marketing, the next question is obvious: Where should you actually be doing this?In this episode, I break down the four environments where Zero Click Marketing thrives — the places on the internet where influence happens before someone ever clicks a link. From social feeds to AI answers, these platforms reward content that delivers value natively. If you understand where ZCM happens, you can create content that builds trust, recognition, and demand — even when you can’t track the click.I also share three real-world examples of Zero Click Marketing in action, including a fascinating product launch from Seattle Ultrasonics that shows how a single piece of content can explain — and sell — an entirely new category.New here? Start with Episode 2: What Zero Click Marketing Actually Is.Timestamps:00:00 Intro and orientation01:00 Where ZCM generally works best01:30 The four environments where ZCM specifically works best05:25 The pattern of ZCM05:55 3 case studies of ZCM in the wild06:01 ZCM when you've created a totally new category07:56 ZCM in a highly-competitive space09:12 ZCM with a core idea and remixing across channels/formats10:33 Next week: Brendan Hufford tells his firsthand experience with ZCM!Learn more: zeroclickmarketing.coConnect with Amanda Natividad (@amandanat): LinkedIn | Substack | Instagram | Threads

You know the zero click problem is real. But how do you get your CEO or CMO on board — and how do you prove it's working once they are? In this episode, I chat with Rand Fishkin to talk measurement frameworks, his new AI visibility research, and why correlation (not causation) is the name of the game.Guest: Rand Fishkin, Co-founder and CEO of SparkToroKey takeaway:Zero Click Marketing is not about giving up on sales or clicks. It’s about accepting that influence often happens before the click — and measuring that influence more honestly.Timestamps:00:00 "All the things that happen in a zero click environment will eventually lead to the same thing that clicks led to"01:13 What do you tell an executive who believes in zero click but doesn't know what to do next?04:20 How to start thinking about measurement when there's no single dashboard to point to07:41 The double standard: executives are comfortable with fuzzy measurement for TV and display ads, but demand perfect attribution for content, influencers, and PR11:02 Where your competitors refuse to invest leaves more room for you14:07 AI hype as a Trojan horse to convince skeptics: if you believe AI is the future, what's the logical conclusion of AI summarizing content?17:22 AI as both the cause of and a mental model for zero click19:14 Rand and Gumshoe's AI visibility research: Rand noticed AI gives different answers to the same prompt every time, which made him skeptical of the entire AI rank-tracking industry24:12 The big finding: you'd need ~1,000 prompts to get the same ranked answer — rank tracking is unreliable. But brand visibility percentage is real.29:08 AI visibility as a trackable indicator for zero click marketing success33:36 Myth busting: zero click marketing ≠ zero sales, and it's not just a Google problem — it's every platformThis episode is brought to you by SparkToro — the audience research tool that helps you find where your audience spends time, what they read, watch, and listen to, and who influences them. Learn more at sparktoro.com. And be sure to check out Gumshoe.ai for search and AI visibility. Edited by Share Your Genius (shareyourgenius.com)Learn more about Zero Click Marketing and Amanda Natividad:zeroclickmarketing.coamandanat.comAmanda's LinkedIn and Instagram

If clicks are your primary success metric, you're probably undercounting what's working — and over-rewarding what isn't. In the debut episode of Zero Click Marketing, I (Amanda Natividad) make the case that the click-based funnel isn't just outdated, it's actively misleading. And the cost isn't just bad measurement — it's bad decisions.In this episode:Why the click-based funnel made sense for a while — and exactly when it brokeHow Google, Instagram, LinkedIn, TikTok, and X all quietly started hoarding traffic What "dark social" is, and why it's a bigger deal than most teams realizeWhy AI tools like ChatGPT are the next frontier of zero-click — and what that means for your brandThe 95/5 rule: why optimizing for conversions means ignoring 80% of your future buyersAmanda's own story: how she grew from 1,000 to 100,000+ followers without ever spending a dimeKey insight from this episode:"When you stop optimizing for the click and start optimizing for genuine value in the platform, you end up with better clicks — more intentional ones from people who actually want to be there."This episode is brought to you by SparkToro — the audience research tool that helps you find where your audience spends time, what they read, watch, and listen to, and who influences them. Learn more at sparktoro.com.This episode was edited by Share Your Genius (shareyourgenius.com)Learn more about Zero Click Marketing and Amanda Natividad:zeroclickmarketing.coamandanat.comFollow @amandanat on LinkedIn and Instagram