The Digital Marketing Podcast

How to Fix AI Slop: Better Context, Stronger Brands and the Return of Human Judgement What happens when AI makes it easier to produce marketing content, but that content all starts to look and sound the same? In this episode of The Digital Marketing Podcast, Ciaran Rogers speaks to Evan Greally, founder and CTO of Pacey AI, about avoiding AI slop and getting back to the work that matters: understanding customers, developing ideas and building a distinctive brand. Introduced by Daniel Rowles, the conversation draws on Evan's experience as Head of Creative Tech and Innovation at Droga5 Dublin, part of Accenture Song, and more than 15 years working where creativity and technology meet. What begins with an AI-powered mint plant becomes a wider discussion about data overload, creative control and whether AI can develop something resembling taste. Along the way, Evan explains the thinking behind Pacey, with lessons that extend well beyond any single platform. In This Episode From a talking mint plant to a conversation with nature: Evan shares the story behind The Talking Tree, a project that combined environmental sensors, plant responses and AI-generated conversation. It is an unusual starting point with a serious creative question behind it: could technology encourage people to reconnect with the world around them, rather than spend more time staring at a screen? Why marketing needs to ask "so what?": Customer reviews, social comments, competitor activity and dashboards can all contain useful information. But what should a marketer actually do with it? Ciaran and Evan explore the gap between collecting data and making decisions, and why adding another tool can make that gap wider rather than close it. The value of "honest silence": Evan introduces Pacey's principle of surfacing what matters without manufacturing urgency. He describes a system that looks for support from three or more sources before highlighting an issue, but can also tell a team there is nothing significant to worry about that day. The aim is to focus attention, not create another stream of notifications. Can AI really have taste? Evan argues that AI can develop a useful form of brand-specific taste, while distinguishing it from the personal experience and judgement that shape human taste. He explains how approved copy and visuals help build a brand's taste profile, and why evaluating work from an audience member's perspective may be more revealing than asking a model to give it a numerical score. Would someone actually stop scrolling? Turning a daily briefing into useful action: From a short, podcast-style morning update to content creation, scheduling and performance feedback, Evan outlines how Pacey connects market signals with marketing activity. The discussion explores what changes when a team can move from understanding an opportunity to developing a response without repeatedly copying information between disconnected tools. Why editable creative matters: Ciaran highlights the importance of layered design files rather than finished images that are difficult to change. Evan explains how this approach supports human editing, reusable templates, a brand's own photography and different identities across multiple outlets. He also previews an editable video workflow using customers' own footage, rather than relying entirely on generated visuals. An orchestra, not another isolated instrument: Could marketers build something similar by connecting their own AI tools? Evan acknowledges the potential for prototypes, but explains why filtering data, maintaining context, applying design constraints and continually evaluating results are harder to reproduce. The conversation uses an orchestra analogy to explore how different models and specialist agents can work towards the same creative goal. Building trust before speeding things up: Evan shares a product-development lesson: giving people a login is not the same as helping them adopt a new way of working. Slower onboarding, visible sources and clear explanations of how conclusions were reached became central to building confidence. Throughout the discussion, people remain responsible for deciding what is right for the brand and approving what gets published. Key Takeaways Start with the marketing decision, not the dashboard. Before collecting another metric or adding another tool, ask what it will help you understand, change or prioritise. Give AI direction, not just information. Relevant customer signals, a clear brand perspective and a defined purpose matter more than handing a model an undifferentiated pile of data. Treat creative approval as a learning opportunity. Human choices about copy and design can help establish what good work looks like for a particular brand. That judgement should shape the process, not disappear from it. Keep the work editable and the reasoning visible. Teams need to be able to refine creative assets and inspect the evidence behind recommendations, rather than simply accept whatever a system produces. Use automation to make room for better thinking. The ambition discussed here is not to fill every channel with more posts. It is to give marketers more time to understand their audience, develop ideas and deliver the right message at the right moment. Can AI learn a brand's preferences well enough to demonstrate taste, or does that word belong to human creativity? Listen to the conversation and share your perspective with the team. As Daniel explains in the introduction, The Digital Marketing Podcast has no commercial connection to Pacey AI. 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/how-to-fix-ai-slop

Search is changing fast. With AI overviews now appearing in the majority of Google results, the rules of visibility are being rewritten in real time. In this episode, Daniel Rowles explores what answer engine optimisation actually means in practice, and how marketers can adapt without chasing myths, hacks, or constantly shifting theories. Drawing on real testing from Target Internet over the past year, this episode cuts through the noise around GEO, AEO, and SEO to focus on what genuinely works. The result is a practical framework for improving visibility both in traditional organic search and within AI-powered results, particularly Google's AI overviews. If you are worried about falling click-through rates, changing user behaviour, or how large language models decide what to reference, this episode provides clear, grounded guidance. Rather than treating AI search as a black box to be cracked, Daniel reframes it as a probability system influenced by clarity, credibility, and consistency. The five techniques covered here are designed to future-proof your content strategy while still delivering value to real users today. In This Episode Why the industry cannot agree on GEO vs AEO, and why the distinction matters less than you think What current data tells us about AI overviews, click-through rates, and changing search behaviour How question-led content aligns with the way people now search using AI Why inverted pyramid writing is suddenly more important than ever How digital PR and brand mentions influence entity reputation in AI systems The growing role of advocacy, reviews, and online sentiment in visibility Why multimodal content is becoming a core ranking signal, not a nice-to-have How schema markup removes ambiguity for search engines and large language models Where to focus your effort while Google's AI results are still evolving rapidly Key Takeaways Answer engine optimisation overlaps heavily with traditional SEO, so doubling down on fundamentals is still smart Clear, direct answers to specific questions improve your chances of being referenced by AI Brand visibility is no longer just about links, but about being mentioned in the right contexts Positive sentiment and third-party validation increasingly influence AI recommendations Publishing content in multiple formats strengthens your overall search footprint Structured data helps machines understand your content, and humans engage with it more easily 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/answer-engine-optimisation-aeo-how-to-optimise-for-google-ai-overviews

In this episode of The Digital Marketing Podcast, Daniel Rowles and Ciaran Rogers dive into one of the most significant shifts in digital marketing: the rise of non keyword signals and what it means for search, privacy, and the future of campaign targeting. With AI-powered ad platforms like Google's AI Max and social algorithms driven by behavioural data rather than search intent, the old model of keyword-driven marketing is rapidly giving way to something more opaque, more personalised, and potentially more invasive. Daniel and Ciaran explore how AI systems now use a vast array of signals, from your browsing patterns and email content to your location history and viewing habits, to anticipate what you might want before you even search. But what does this mean for marketers who've spent years honing their SEO and PPC strategies? And what does it mean for user privacy in a world where your chatbot conversations may be fuelling ad targeting? In This Episode: What are non keyword signals? Understand how platforms like Google and Meta are using behaviour, context and historical activity instead of just search terms. Why your impressions are up but clicks are down Learn how AI summaries in Google Search are reducing organic click-throughs, even when your rankings are strong. AI Max campaigns and keywordless targeting Discover how Google Ads is shifting towards AI-led campaigns that rely on intent and engagement signals rather than keyword triggers , and why some brands are seeing 20–30% uplift as a result. What Meta's CMO said about disconnected content Hear how Alex Schultz explained the shift from connected (likes, follows) to disconnected content (Reels, Stories, Shorts), and what that means for social strategy. Privacy concerns and grey areas Explore the implications of Meta's new terms allowing AI chat interactions to inform ad targeting, and whether AI chat data could be inadvertently shared or commercialised. Real-world scenario: Chatbots used for lead capture Daniel raises a powerful example, what if you offered a free AI chatbot to other brands, then harvested user intent data for your own ad targeting? Platform security, data visibility and agent risks From OneDrive access errors to AI agents managing your logins, the hosts discuss the human errors that AI amplifies, and the need for robust security practices. Key Takeaways: We're entering a post-keyword era Platforms are using AI to interpret intent through broader, richer data sources, including chat behaviour, video viewing and app usage. Organic traffic is being cannibalised by AI summaries Even if your visibility improves, actual user clicks may continue to decline. Privacy risks are growing Terms and conditions are changing, and conversations with AI tools may no longer be as private as they seem. Marketing teams must audit how they use AI Understand what data your AI tools are accessing and how that data could be used, now and in the future. Join the conversation This isn't just a podcast - it's an open debate. Daniel and Ciaran want your input, and they're giving away prizes, books and merch to contributors. 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/the-big-debate-non-keyword-signals-ai-chats-privacy Join the debate: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7403862051749564417

In this episode of The Digital Marketing Podcast, Daniel Rowles is joined by Matthew Gardiner from World Travel Market for a special look at how the user journey is being radically reshaped, and why the travel industry offers a powerful lens for understanding the broader changes all marketers now face. From AI-powered search and agents, to disconnected content ecosystems, collapsing funnels, and new expectations for sustainability and meaning, the way users discover, evaluate, and buy has shifted. Whether you work in travel or not, this episode delivers insight into how to adapt your digital strategy for a fragmented, AI-enhanced, and purpose-driven customer journey. In This Episode: Why AI is collapsing the funnel Users no longer move in a straight line from awareness to action. Conversations with AI agents like ChatGPT are replacing multi-step journeys. Whoever owns the AI conversation, owns the customer. From connected to disconnected content The shift from traditional, connected social feeds to short-form, algorithmically driven discovery (Reels, TikToks, Shorts) has changed how we build awareness and trust. AI Overviews and Answer Engine Optimisation With 55% of Google searches now including AI summaries, Daniel explains why SEO alone is not enough and how Generative Engine Optimisation (GEO) and Answer Engine Optimisation (AEO) are the new battlegrounds. Agents are doing the work From itinerary planning to automated bookings, AI agents are reshaping how users interact with brands, often bypassing websites altogether. The new role of structured data Matthew shares how travel brands must now treat structured markup (schema) as a new kind of distribution, ensuring they are machine-readable to AI systems. Why user testing must change Daniel explains why marketers must rethink usability testing to account for personalised algorithms, behaviour-based ad targeting, and AI-powered search. Brand loyalty as a survival tactic In an age of disintermediation, programmes like Bonvoy are keeping users loyal through gamification and exclusive benefits, offering lessons for all industries. Content strategy for the AI era From FAQs and multilingual support to video answers and UGC, the path to visibility is paved with granular, high-quality, human-first content. Industry Case Study: Travel Through a detailed conversation with Matthew Gardiner, the episode explores how the travel industry has continually adapted to disruption. From the rise of OTAs and TripAdvisor to today's challenges around AI agents, soft adventure trends, live tourism, and sustainability expectations, travel may be the canary in the coal mine but its lessons are highly applicable to every sector. Key Takeaways: AI is not just changing how people search; it is rewriting how people trust, book, and choose. Being mentioned in AI conversations is the new SEO. Structured data and FAQ-rich content are your ticket in. Agents now do things, not just recommend. Optimising for transactions and post-click experience is vital. Loyalty schemes, brand identity, and customer advocacy matter more than ever to bypass AI's generic results. Usability testing must reflect real, personalised experiences, not idealised lab setups. 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/the-changing-user-journey-lessons-from-the-travel-industry 📩 Join the free newsletter for access to monthly live sessions: https://targetinternet.com/newsletter

Far beyond a productivity hack or sustainability trend, the regenerative mindset offers marketers and leaders a framework to design work, creativity and impact that helps build value. You'll have to listen to find out about the Goose! Drawing from systems thinking and marketing strategy, Daniel and Ciaran challenge the "hustle at all costs" mentality and instead champion a more humane, resilient and adaptable approach to digital marketing. In This Episode: What is a Regenerative Mindset? Understand the key difference between sustainability and regeneration - why one aims to sustain the status quo and the other aims to restore, replenish, and grow. Rethinking Productivity and Growth Explore why traditional productivity models are failing marketers in the age of AI, information overload, and fragmented attention, and what to do instead. AI as a Regenerative Tool Rather than using AI to do more, faster, Daniel and Ciaran explore how AI can help reduce cognitive burden, fuel creativity, and foster experimentation when used mindfully. Designing Regenerative Marketing Systems Discover how regenerative principles, such as reciprocity, interdependence, and feedback loops, can help build more sustainable, and effective marketing strategies. Tools, Mindsets and Micro-practices From digital decluttering to reflective learning and systems thinking, the hosts share practical approaches to integrating regeneration into your professional life. Key Takeaways: Regeneration is not about working less, it's about working in flow with better results and less burnout Marketers must go beyond campaign thinking and start designing ecosystems of value and renewal Rest, reflection and curiosity are not luxuries, they're strategic assets A regenerative mindset helps you lead through complexity and adapt with clarity The future of digital marketing isn't just AI or data, it's resilience, systems thinking, and human-centred creativity. 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/regenerative-marketing-mindset-reimagining-marketing-and-leadership 📩 Join the free newsletter for access to monthly live sessions: https://targetinternet.com/newsletter

In this episode of The Digital Marketing Podcast, Daniel Rowles and Ciaran Rogers explore one of the most transformative shifts in digital marketing: the arrival of ChatGPT Agent and the rise of agent-based AI. No longer just about generating content, AI is now taking action on our behalf, logging into websites, filling out forms, analysing data, creating content, and even posting to platforms like LinkedIn. It's here now, and it's changing how marketing teams work from the ground up. Daniel shares his firsthand experiments with ChatGPT Agent, from connecting it to Canva to create and publish carousel posts, to testing its ability to analyse his entire LinkedIn history and recommend strategies for future content. While the possibilities are jaw-dropping, the hosts also explore the risks, security concerns, talent pipeline challenges, and the long-term implications for marketing roles. In this episode, you'll learn: What agent-based AI really is and why it's different from traditional AI chat tools How ChatGPT Agent combines deep research, web browsing, and autonomous task execution Real-world test cases, from generating content to posting directly on LinkedIn Why prompt quality and structure are more important than ever The security and compliance risks of connecting agents to business systems How agent-driven automation could replace many junior marketing tasks Why agility and learning culture are now critical for businesses to survive disruption The ethical and strategic questions marketers need to face around job design and human oversight The discussion goes beyond technology to look at the human side of digital marketing. Daniel and Ciaran debate the future of junior roles, how companies can avoid gutting their talent pipelines, and why brands that lean into humanity, creativity, and trust may stand out in an AI-driven landscape. Key Takeaways: ChatGPT Agent is a genuine step change, going from AI that suggests, to AI that does. Marketing teams can gain huge efficiency, but must double-check outputs and guard against overreliance. Security is now a critical concern, as agents gain access to business-critical systems. Junior marketing roles are at risk, companies must balance efficiency with long-term talent growth. Building an agile learning culture is the best defence against AI disruption. 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/chatgpt-agent-and-the-future-of-digital-marketing 📩 Join the free newsletter for access to monthly live sessions: https://targetinternet.com/newsletter

In this episode of The Digital Marketing Podcast, Daniel Rowles is joined by Brendan Kane, viral strategist and author of One Million Followers, for a deep dive into the art and science of making content go viral. Going viral often feels like marketing mythology,something bosses ask for, but few can explain or deliver. Brendan, however, has built a career proving that virality isn't luck. It's repeatable, measurable, and rooted in storytelling structures that have worked for decades. Brendan shares the behind-the-scenes thinking that led to his experiment growing an audience of 1 million followers in 30 days, starting from scratch, without a team, celebrity status, or advertising budget. More than a vanity metric, the project was a proof-of-concept for a framework that now helps brands, creators, and entrepreneurs reliably generate massive reach and meaningful engagement. In this episode, you'll learn: Why qualitative analysis - not just views and clicks, holds the key to repeatable success The power of storytelling formats like "Man on the Street" and "Two Characters, One Light Bulb" How to match your brand's resources and personality to the right format Why volume isn't the answer, and what quality actually means in the age of AI and infinite content Why originality is overrated, and how proven formats unlock creativity instead of limiting it How even "boring" industries like tax, insurance, and leather craftsmanship can thrive on social media The truth about "frequency myths" and how creators burn out chasing quantity over story Why format mastery trumps trend-chasing—and how sitcoms, Spielberg, and social media are more alike than you think Brendan also breaks down his format-matching process, built from over 10,000 hours of research and analysis of 300+ viral content structures. His agency works with individuals and brands to identify the storytelling structures that resonate most with their audience, and helps them build repeatable, on-brand content that doesn't just go viral, but converts. This conversation flips conventional marketing wisdom on its head, challenging the obsession with originality and encouraging marketers to focus on structure, story, and strategic authenticity. Key Takeaways: Virality isn't random, it's engineered through proven creative models Storytelling formats provide containers for creativity, not limitations Format mastery enables faster growth and deeper audience trust Business outcomes must be baked into your content strategy from day one Social media isn't just another channel, it's the ultimate storytelling platform 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/how-to-go-viral 📩 Join the free newsletter for access to Daniel's monthly live sessions: https://targetinternet.com/newsletter

In this episode of The Digital Marketing Podcast, Daniel Rowles explores one of the most unexpected but powerful business case studies in modern branding: Taylor Swift! Joined by Kevin Evers, Senior Editor at Harvard Business Review and author of There's Nothing Like This. Kevin dives into how Swift's career offers a masterclass in brand strategy, audience connection, and long-term business thinking. Why does a global superstar in a notoriously cutthroat industry continue to outperform and outlast her peers? According to Kevin, it's not luck or fandom - it's strategy. Drawing on insights from his newly released book, Kevin breaks down the key inflection points in Swift's 20-year career. From turning down a major label at age 13 to preserve creative control, to executing one of the boldest rebranding and ownership moves in music history with her "Taylor's Version" re-recordings, this episode examines how Swift embodies the core principles of marketing, product-market fit, and customer obsession. Daniel and Kevin unpack how Taylor Swift: Identified a niche audience when the data said it wasn't viable Built trust and intimacy into her brand from day one Embraced user-generated content and fan communities to expand reach Navigated multiple brand pivots without losing authenticity Took complete ownership of her brand and intellectual property Continues to evolve while staying aligned to her audience's needs They also explore how her fandom operates as a distributed marketing engine, elevating everything from live streams to lyric analysis and decoding hidden clues. With references to startup thinking, customer experience design, and even parallels with Jobs-to-Be-Done theory, this conversation turns a pop icon into a blueprint for brand building at scale. Whether you're a marketer, entrepreneur or brand strategist, this episode offers rare insight into what it takes to build something culturally durable, and fiercely customer-centric. Key Takeaways: Brand clarity trumps market data when paired with conviction Fan communities can become your most powerful marketing asset Ownership and authenticity are strategic decisions, not just personal ones Pivoting is easier when you've built long-term trust Obsessing over your audience is a competitive advantage 📥 Access the show notes, tools, and links at: https://targetinternet.com/resources/strategy-branding-and-taylor-swift 📩 Join the free newsletter for access to Daniel's monthly live sessions: https://targetinternet.com/newsletter